Getting raised/checkraised on the river

Dudd · #1 05-19-2005, 09:59 PM

I'm in the midst of a 7k hand break even stretch and trying to find holes in my game. I think I make a crying call way too often on the river in these situations, as for whatever reason I feel very stubborn to lay hands down to raises or checkraises when I have any sort of a hand. While I don't think this is a huge leak (it took me five minutes going though my pokertracker database to find two hands that fit this criteria), whenever I make the play I feel dirty since I can't remember the last time I won in a situation like this, yet I can't get myself to throw the hand away. Anyways, in hand 1 the villian is a 16/7, but I felt that his preflop raise could have been an attempt to isolate against the fish who had already called. Villian in hand 2 is a total donk, with a 65/6 and a sub 1 aggressiveness factor.

Hand 1

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
5 folds, CO calls, Button raises, Hero calls, BB calls, CO calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, CO checks, Button bets, Hero raises, BB folds, CO calls, Button calls.

Turn: (7 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, CO folds, Button calls.

River: (9 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, Button raises, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 13 BB

Hand Two

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
4 folds, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, 1 fold.

Flop: (5 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.

River: (5.50 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB raises, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 9.50 BB

Nick C · #2 05-19-2005, 10:50 PM

Hand 1: I kind of want to check-call the river, actually. I can't figure out any hands you're still beating that Button might still be in with and will call with now besides KJ and QJ. Then again, I don't know that he'll bet those hands himself very often, on this board, after the strength you've shown, and he probably won't bluff AK/AQ/KQ either.

Anyway, I think bet-folding is an option too. I don't like bet-calling too much here, unless you've seen Button make a river bluff-raise before. (A read on his postflop play would be helpful, if you have one.)

Anyway, if I had been doing much bet-folding on the river prior to this hand, I don't think I'd do it again now against a 16/7 guy who possibly has taken notice (though if he's on a lot of tables, maybe all he really knows is your stats).

Edit: I guess what I'm saying is that most of the time, I think you're going to lose an additional bet on the river or gain nothing extra but win the pot, no matter what you do. Given that situation, I think I'd want to go to showdown for one or zero river bets.

Hand 2: Aw, jeez. I guess you probably should fold to the river checkraise, but I would most likely pay it off and make SB show me his AQ or TT or KT or T4s or Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or 22 or 44 or whatever it is that he has.

Given your description of SB, though, I doubt you're good here often enough to call, really. So I guess what I'm saying is that calling this particular river checkraise is probably bad and I would have made the same mistake.