Black bullets in poker heaven. Should I have listened to HEFAP?

[Huh]

Okay, maybe this is standard, but figured I'd post it.

I have black aces in middle/late position. Online $3-$6 game.

4 callers to me, I raise, and we see the flop eight handed for 2 bets each.

The flop seems innocent enough. It's
T 5 2 rainbow.

It's checked to me, and I bet. The whole table calls.

The turn puts up a Jack. Again it's checked to me, I bet and get two callers, both later than I.

The river is an eight.

I bet and get two callers. The button turns over T8 for the rivered two-pair and drags a pretty decent pot.

My main question about this hand is the flop bet. I've read HEFAP countless times, but sometimes its impossible to practice what I read. So, should I have checked the flop and just called, hoping to confront people with a double turn bet? This sounds like such a good idea in theory, but on a rainbow uncoordinated board like this, I hate giving out a free card and letting people pick up a draw on the turn.


Any other comments on the hand would also be greatly appreciated, but it's the flop that I wonder about most.
-Huh

[GrinningBuddha]

It sounds like you would have had trouble finding someone else to bet before you so that you could raise the turn. Also factor in the fact that someone who calls two bets preflop with T8 is probably going to call two on the turn in a pot that size in order to catch his 8. I don't know if there was anything you could have done to win this hand besides hit your A on the river. :/

[Bob T.]

I like bet, bet, bet, call if you have to with this hand.

[Mike]

You mean this isn't SOP at the table? Welcome to schooling. It's very common where I play in the day time. It has it's good points and bad. When you have only an okay hand but not the best by far you know the guy two seats down will bet it for you so you can check.

I do not see what you could have done differently. When your AA takes down those pots you will be very happy you bet each round.

[rigoletto]

So, should I have checked the flop and just called, hoping to confront people with a double turn bet?

No, look at it this way: you got 5 callers on the flop who folded for 1 bet on the turn anyway.

You can only face them with 2 on the turn if somebody else is betting.

[LetsRock]

I think you did everything you could to play this hand correctly. You made everyone put the most in that you could on every round.

These guys aren't going anywhere calling with hands like T8 and then catching a piece of the board and it's not likely that such calling stations are going to do anything "drastic" like testing your PFR with a raise on the TP flop.

Sometimes, there's nothing more you can do. It sux, but it happens.

[BigBaitsim (milo)]

Pre-flop - Bet
Flop - Bet
Turn - Bet
River - Bet

I don't see anyone with anything to bet if you check the flop.

[colgin]

You played this just fine. You had no indication that someone would bet this board for you if you went for a checkraise and you certainly don't want to give away a free card here. Sometimes bad things happen to good Aces. Don't lose any sleep over this.

[Magikist]

Huh,

As you can see, you can't be faulted for betting every chance you got in this hand.

Indeed, the theories HPFAP expounds are sometimes hard to put into practice. When confronted by hands like yours, though, I believe you really have to try and get a check-raise in there.

I disagree with people who don't think this flop will be bet by people behind you. There's merit to letting one of them bet and then check-raising a whole field with the best hand.

And if it checks around? Yes, you do give a free card, but your hand is not vulnerable to overcards. In fact it lets you raise someone in front of you and make the field face calling two big bets cold. If it is checked to you, then you confront your opponents with a big bet (as opposed to a small bet on the flop).

While betting this flop is not always wrong, it is imperative in big pots with big pocket pairs to eliminate as many opponents as possible. Betting the flop will not accomplish this.

[pudley4]

Your comments don't fit together.

[ QUOTE ]
There's merit to letting one of them (the players behind you) bet and then check-raising a whole field with the best hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is how you build a pot. Nothing wrong with building a pot. However, you later say:

[ QUOTE ]
it is imperative in big pots with big pocket pairs to eliminate as many opponents as possible. Betting the flop will not accomplish this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Checkraising here won't accomplish this either, since you'll be making most of the field call one bet at a time.

So which are you trying to do: build the pot, or knock players out?