Failed screw play

Nietzsche · #1 11-14-2005, 05:51 PM

Opponent is almost certainly a 2+2'er. Stats 25/15/2.5. Haven't seen him get out of line.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP raises, 2 folds, Hero 3-bets, 1 fold, MP calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets, MP calls.

Turn: (4.50 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets, Hero raises, MP 3-bets, Hero folds.

Looks wierd, felt wierd but how often am I good here? Is this not a set or two pair 90% of the time?

DCWildcat · #2 11-14-2005, 05:53 PM

Why the turn c/r?

DrSavage · #3 11-14-2005, 06:06 PM

I don't think you can fold here.

brazilio · #4 11-14-2005, 06:08 PM

I can't fold here, I've seen way too many 2+2ers go almost maniacal on turn checkraises like this with hands they'd likely just call the turn with. I don't understand the turn c/r, though.

Fianchetto · #5 11-14-2005, 06:11 PM

Bad fold. I think you need to take this to showdown.

Catt · #6 11-14-2005, 07:29 PM

I don't think you should fold when you decide to employ the screwplay. The line looks somewhat strange to your opponent -- either a risky but tricky method to squeeze an extra BB out of someone who will see a SD; or a goofy line by someone with air trying to fold out the opponent. If the guy doesn't know a lot about your play, he could easily be three-betting a worse hand here.

Nietzsche · #7 11-14-2005, 08:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think you should fold when you decide to employ the screwplay. The line looks somewhat strange to your opponent -- either a risky but tricky method to squeeze an extra BB out of someone who will see a SD; or a goofy line by someone with air trying to fold out the opponent. If the guy doesn't know a lot about your play, he could easily be three-betting a worse hand here.

[/ QUOTE ]
Interesting analysis. My thoughts are that a screw play from a TAG is a very powerful move, almost never a bluff. I would think this is his thinking too. He knows I'm a TAG with a very similar playing style and similar stats. This is the reason I thought I could fold to a 3-bet. I just can't see a TAG bluffing here. And I thought there was almost no chance he would do this with a hand like AJ.

But of course it is dangerous to think your opponent thinks exactly like you so maybe I should have called down.

aK13 · #8 11-14-2005, 08:04 PM

Just a consideration...why would you want to screwplay a 2+2er? They can make folds -- so why would you want your opponent to fold a worse hand here when he might otherwise just call/call the rest as WA/WB?

setjes · #9 11-14-2005, 08:10 PM

This is a line I often take against aggro's. Once villain calls an A-high ragged flop (rather without fd possibilities) he bets the turn about 95% when checked to with smaller aces, pp's or nothing. Easy way to get more value out of ur big aces. Besides, it may buy u a free card later on because ur opponent may be scared for another c/r.
I'd call his 3bet down btw.

donger · #10 11-14-2005, 08:58 PM

This might not be the best place to screwplay. If the guy is a thinking player, he might check a lot of worse hands here, planning to call the river or bet if checked to. You also get yourself into scenarios like this one where you deny yourself a showdown.

I am a huge proponent of the screwplay, but I like it against the dumber, more aggro types who do a lot of cold-calling preflop.