On Holidays, Family, and Church

[New001]

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You don't think that coming to your own conclusion about the world isn't a little more advanced than doing what your father does because your father does it?

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Becoming one's own man is a process that does not automatically imply the abandonment of fatherly emulation. If a son who admires his Dad so much that he wishes to emulate his father to whatever extent (a desire amongst many fathers I'm sure), this does not automatically imply that the son has stagnated intellectually.

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If I wanted to become a musician (my father's occupation as I grew up), then I can. If I wanted to be Buddhist (his religion), I can. Either of those decisions are going to be made based on what I think is best for me and my life, or my family, or my future, not because it's what my father did.

And what if I do decide to emulate my father? Good for me. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm just saying that I would hope any son I raise will look at other options and decide for himself what's best.

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I'm just saying that I would hope any son I raise will look at other options and decide for himself what's best.

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And my question was, that upon your son's assessment of his options in life, and one option (yours) being favored, perhaps heavily, per his admiration of you, to what extent does this demonstrate a lesser level of thinking?

And I don't think it is debatable that a father's desire for a son's emulation on at least several levels does in fact exist (even if you don't feel as though that is in your future) hence the feeling of failure I suppose I would feel upon my son's rejection of my beliefs.

[New001]

Do you not see a difference between "Following the same religion as your father because he's your father" and "Choosing the same religion as your father because it makes more sense to you than your other options?" The latter I support entirely, the former seems lazy.

My original statement was intended to be 100% about religion, even if it does apply in other situations.

You seem to believe that choosing your own religion is a set point in one's life, as though it happens when you turn 18. It happens only upon a rejection of your father/mother's religion first (assuming there was one). This generally elicits disappoinment on the parent's end.

The process of rejection was just that - a thought process. But this does not imply a superior level of thinking to the individual whose thoughts were dedicated elsewhere (perhaps within the religion itself) and not to the assessment and subsequent rejection of the ideals of the parents which he admires so much. This applies entirely to ideals and principles, as there is no intellectual gain (or loss) from rejecting buddhism and taking up judaism.

This false sense of superior thinking is what I believe leads many to gleefully declare their atheism, as if the rejection of their primitive parents' religion were some sort of victory (suggesting an advanced sort of authority complex). You can witness this snug superiority repeatedly, again and again, right here on this forum.

[imported_luckyme]

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And my question was, that upon your son's assessment of his options in life, and one option (yours) being favored, perhaps heavily, per his admiration of you, to what extent does this demonstrate a lesser level of thinking?

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I'd be mightily disappointed as a father if a grown child of mine allowed any decision to be weighed with "his admiration of me". I want to raise independant thinking adults, not father worshippers/pleasers. I hope I have set an example of being honest, trustworthy, reasonable, fair, etc ( not without slippage ) and those attributes are attributes they have, and when choices arise I hope those attributes lead to good ones. Tossing in "admiration for dad" should have moved way,way out of the picture by the time he's an adult or I will have failed.

On the OP's initial question - being upfront is the main issue. I conducted an atheist funeral a couple years ago for a mostly religious audience, including the childs pastor. The pastor was one of the first, of many, to come up and comment on how well it went. In the situation the OP is in, it may not work as well because the 'upfront' will only be with his family and not the congregation, some of who may be uncomfortable with a atheistic approach to the service. I'd bow out to avoid making what should be a pleasant experience a bit less so for others. If the family doesn't understand, this will be the least of your troubles.

luckyme

[KaneKungFu123]

riddick,

you must have some dumb kids.

KKF,

Nice stab at me, but I'm 21. Jackass.

- Riddick

Riddick:
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The life and teachings of Jesus Christ, though not always in practice 100% (nor should that be expected) fall under the "my values" category, which, if not successfully transmitted through the gene pool would, as I said, leave me with a feeling of failure.

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Riddick:[ QUOTE ]
KKF, Nice stab at me, but I'm 21. Jackass.

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I think Jesus would consider you to be lukewarm. Pah-tooey!

I'm sure you'll come back with an insult to me... which I'm sure Jesus will again be proud of. You know, hate your enemies... curse those who curse you... if someone slaps you, slap them back. Those are the very things Jesus taught.

[Lestat]

Instead of failure, you should feel pride that you have raised a son who is his own man.

And if he winds up an atheist, you should also take solace that he probably turned out a little smarter than his dad. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

(sorry, couldn't resist).

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And if he winds up an atheist, you should also take solace that he probably turned out a little smarter than his dad.

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My values lie more in being a man of honor, integrity, hard work, and discipline (something they'll get at Parris Island [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] ) over being an intellectual bookworm with a higher paying job than me, atheist or not.