1/2 nl live TT preflop UTG

meleader2 · #1 11-14-2005, 05:19 PM

hero has ~150$ UTG with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], makes it 7$ to go.

4 callers to LP whom is a thinking player, has me covered, makes it 40$ to go.

my thought process is the following:

he either thinks i have AK and wants to isolate with a lower PP (77-99...maybe JJ/QQ), or he has AA/KK. what do you do? call for set value, push, or fold. i think 40$/33$ to call for set value is horrible.

i chose to push. anyone in agreement?

djoyce003 · #2 11-14-2005, 05:22 PM

this is essentially a hand that will be all-in on the flop no matter what if you call, so for me your options are push or fold.

My problem with this hand is that I think you are at best a coin-flip against this villain and could be completely crushed here. Your UTG raise indicates a strong holding and that just got reraised...it would take major balls to do this with a baby pocket pair because the chances you have QQ-AA are decent along with AK...all of which are calling or pushing.

given all those factors I fold here.

Spekkio · #3 11-14-2005, 05:23 PM

There is no way a "thinking" player at $1/2 NL is re-raising the UTG pre-flop raiser without AK, AA, KK, or QQ, simply because like you said there were a few other callers in the hand. You are beat most of the time, and when you're not you're a coin-flip, so you should fold. This is why raising with marginal hands or middle pairs UTG is not a good idea.

meleader2 · #4 11-14-2005, 05:26 PM

[ QUOTE ]
There is no way a "thinking" player at $1/2 NL is re-raising the UTG pre-flop raiser without AK, AA, KK, or QQ, simply because like you said there were a few other callers in the hand. You are beat most of the time, and when you're not you're a coin-flip, so you should fold. This is why raising with marginal hands or middle pairs UTG is not a good idea.

[/ QUOTE ]

the action at the table is ridiculously loose. left end of the table is $ heavy, 6 buyins or more they're sitting on. every preflop raise has been done with crap, some without even looking at their hands then it gets called around for "pot odds" (i love the way the other players call it that hoping to hit anything on an inflated flop)

4_2_it · #5 11-14-2005, 05:30 PM

If it's a gamboooling table, I have no problem if you give them what they want. I seen same very strange plays in this environment.

However, in most cases, a fold is not bad here because you will most likely see an overcard on the flop and you are OOP with a villain who, at worst has some Broadway cards.

BigBiceps · #6 11-14-2005, 05:33 PM

Online, I would fold instantly.

Live players do such strange things, I would push. If he respects you, he may lay down AK, QQ or JJ. If not he may call with A5s or 22.

wiggs73 · #7 11-14-2005, 05:34 PM

A bit off topic for what you're asking, but in my experience, a $7 raise isn't going to get much respect at 1/2 live. I'd like a raise to $12 much more.

meleader2 · #8 11-14-2005, 05:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
A bit off topic for what you're asking, but in my experience, a $7 raise isn't going to get much respect at 1/2 live. I'd like a raise to $12 much more.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're absolutely right, and in fact i was waiting for someone to say that. past hands were leading me to bet less and less due to them not holding up. i was in the hole for quite a bit, and maybe the push was a mistake as well.

i should've made it 15-20$, but i didn't.

villain had QQ.

i spiked a T on the river, but i knew i shouldn't have.

thanks for all the comments!

#9 11-14-2005, 06:36 PM

I'm pretty sure I fold this against the thinking player. But what does this player think about you?

Wayfare · #10 11-14-2005, 09:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]
hero has ~150$ UTG with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], makes it 7$ to go.

4 callers to LP whom is a thinking player, has me covered, makes it 40$ to go.

my thought process is the following:

he either thinks i have AK and wants to isolate with a lower PP (77-99...maybe JJ/QQ), or he has AA/KK. what do you do? call for set value, push, or fold. i think 40$/33$ to call for set value is horrible.

i chose to push. anyone in agreement?

[/ QUOTE ]

With your stack size, a raise to $7 is completely unnecessary and actually very counter productive, as you can see from the hand.