Splishy Splashy Turn Raise

CostaRicaBill · #1 05-03-2005, 04:19 PM

BB is donk, very loose, moderately agro and MP2 is pretty Taggish. Comments on all streets appreciated.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
Hero raises, 2 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, 2 folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (10 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, MP2 raises, MP3 folds, SB calls, BB calls, Hero 3-bets, MP2 calls, SB calls, BB calls.

Turn: (11 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero raises, MP2 calls, SB folds, BB 3-bets, Hero folds, MP2 calls.

Final Pot: 21 BB

CostaRicaBill · #2 05-03-2005, 05:23 PM

Come on, I know this can't be this standard, anyone?

Catt · #3 05-03-2005, 05:53 PM

I want a better read on BB. Is he aggro enough to lead the turn with two pair?

What are your options on the turn? Fold, call, raise. I'm not inclined to fold TP3K to a turn donkbet; I think we're either up against a big A in MP2 (wa/wb situation though likely wa if he has an A) or else a flush draw that he played pretty crumily on the flop unless he had a read that those behind were likely to call 2 cold -- either way, I'm not sure I want to try and force him out. I might call here as I think about it, but that feels really yucky.

I guess I like the raise. Is it "standard"? I don't know.

I am pretty unhappy that I got 3-bet by BB. But getting 18:1 on the turn 3-bet I would pay one more to see the river even if I was veru worried that BB had a set. I don't think that was a good fold at all.

undathesea · #4 05-03-2005, 05:59 PM

With a pot that size... there's no folding. You must call the reraise and check/call the river. BB wakes up on the turn with 3 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]... MP2 starts to call cause he didn't hit his draw on the expensive street... this might be a good time to slow down and call or fold... Looks like BB may have 33 or A3 and you're behind now.

Unfortunately, 90% of the time you're beat, but with a pot worth 20BB in it already... you must showdown. Check/call on the river.

Nick C · #5 05-03-2005, 06:01 PM

Since BB led the turn instead of going for a checkraise (versus two opponents who have shown strength already), I'm thinking he probably has a made hand this is somewhat vulnerable, and I also suspect the 3 helped him (and he isn't simply abandoning his slowplay of a flopped monster).

The turn 3-bet does show a lot of strength, but you're getting an immeiate 18:1. Although unfortunately your hand may not be any better than MP2's (so you could, for instance, be drawing to a chop), I think there's a good enough chance you're up against something like A3 or Q3s or 73s to call.

Of course, you could also be up against 33 or even a flopped monster like 77, but I wouldn't fold. Since I'm not ruling out a hand like 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], I might call again on the river unimproved, actually, but I really would feel like I was making a crying call at that point.

CostaRicaBill · #6 05-03-2005, 07:04 PM

Not calling down enough is one of my leaks, but I'm having trouble finding places to call down more, I guess this is one of those times. My Won$ At Showdown is 58% which I'm sure is too high, what are good players averaging for this? More like 52-56%? I'm also a little bit tighter than normal pf, around 14.5 V$PIP

party36master · #7 05-03-2005, 07:44 PM

Others pointed out that you can't fold the turn, but I don't like the 3 bet on the flop.

The flush draw is gaining equity, not you.