Please Review - All Streets

Ok, I guess this is a horrible call pre-flop. After I pressed the call button, I asked myself "Why the he11 did I do that?". On the flop, I have the 2nd nut straight, a baby-flush draw, and 3rd nut low. Obviously, I became an extreme luck-box on the river to spike the wheel card.

Was this a complete -EV play?

As far as hand selection goes, my double-suited low cards did look appealing.

Looks like Villain1 likes to overbet pre-flop with marginal A2xx, and Villain2 likes to play with garbage.


#Game No : 3048093897
***** Hand History for Game 3048093897 *****
$25 PL Omaha Hi/Lo - Thursday, November 17, 00:15:42 EDT 2005
Table Table 65322 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: tomsnake ( $24.25 )
Seat 4: reppn311 ( $12.80 )
Seat 5: AmourOfGod ( $38.30 )
Seat 7: tomahawk1 ( $48.58 )
Seat 9: LeeLay ( $23.65 )
Seat 10: Hero ( $22.61 )
Seat 6: Daredevil424 ( $24.36 )
Seat 3: DOJO9 ( $16 )
Seat 2: Villain1 ( $25.15 )
Seat 8: Villain2 ( $17.89 )
AmourOfGod posts small blind [$0.10].
Daredevil424 posts big blind [$0.25].
AmourOfGod: vn
Villain2 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ 4h 6s 2s 3h ]
tomahawk1 folds.
Villain2 checks.
LeeLay calls [$0.25].
Hero calls [$0.25].
tomsnake calls [$0.25].
Villain1 raises [$1.85].
DOJO9 folds.
reppn311 folds.
AmourOfGod folds.
Daredevil424 folds.
Villain2 calls [$1.60].
LeeLay calls [$1.60].
Hero calls [$1.60].
tomsnake folds.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 4d, 7s, 5s ]
Villain2 checks.
LeeLay checks.
Hero checks.
Villain1 bets [$7.60].
Villain2 calls [$7.60].
LeeLay folds.
Hero is all-In [$20.76]
Villain1 is all-In [$15.70]
Villain2 is all-In [$8.44]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Jh ]
** Dealing River ** [ Ac ]
Villain1 shows [ As, Js, 9h, 2h ] two pairs, aces and jacks.
Villain1 shows 7,5,4,2,A for low.
Villain2 shows [ 6d, 5d, 6c, 3d ] a straight, three to seven.
Villain2 shows 6,5,4,3,A for low.
Hero shows [ 4h, 6s, 2s, 3h ] a straight, three to seven.
Hero shows 5,4,3,2,A for low.
Villain1 wins $1.27 from side pot #2 with two pairs, aces and jacks.
Villain1 wins Lo ($1.27) from side pot #2 with 7,5,4,2,A.
Hero wins $4.62 from side pot #1 with a straight, three to seven.
Hero wins Lo ($4.62) from side pot #1 with 5,4,3,2,A.
Villain2 wins $13.33 from the main pot with a straight, three to seven.
Hero wins $13.33 from the main pot with a straight, three to seven.
Hero wins Lo ($26.66) from the main pot with 5,4,3,2,A.

[ QUOTE ]
Ok, I guess this is a horrible call pre-flop. After I pressed the call button, I asked myself "Why the he11 did I do that?". On the flop, I have the 2nd nut straight, a baby-flush draw, and 3rd nut low. Obviously, I became an extreme luck-box on the river to spike the wheel card.

Was this a complete -EV play?

As far as hand selection goes, my double-suited low cards did look appealing.

Looks like Villain1 likes to overbet pre-flop with marginal A2xx, and Villain2 likes to play with garbage.


#Game No : 3048093897
***** Hand History for Game 3048093897 *****
$25 PL Omaha Hi/Lo - Thursday, November 17, 00:15:42 EDT 2005
Table Table 65322 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: tomsnake ( $24.25 )
Seat 4: reppn311 ( $12.80 )
Seat 5: AmourOfGod ( $38.30 )
Seat 7: tomahawk1 ( $48.58 )
Seat 9: LeeLay ( $23.65 )
Seat 10: Hero ( $22.61 )
Seat 6: Daredevil424 ( $24.36 )
Seat 3: DOJO9 ( $16 )
Seat 2: Villain1 ( $25.15 )
Seat 8: Villain2 ( $17.89 )
AmourOfGod posts small blind [$0.10].
Daredevil424 posts big blind [$0.25].
AmourOfGod: vn
Villain2 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ 4h 6s 2s 3h ]
tomahawk1 folds.
Villain2 checks.
LeeLay calls [$0.25].
Hero calls [$0.25].
tomsnake calls [$0.25].
Villain1 raises [$1.85].
DOJO9 folds.
reppn311 folds.
AmourOfGod folds.
Daredevil424 folds.
Villain2 calls [$1.60].
LeeLay calls [$1.60].
Hero calls [$1.60].
tomsnake folds.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 4d, 7s, 5s ]
Villain2 checks.
LeeLay checks.
Hero checks.
Villain1 bets [$7.60].
Villain2 calls [$7.60].
LeeLay folds.
Hero is all-In [$20.76]
Villain1 is all-In [$15.70]
Villain2 is all-In [$8.44]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Jh ]
** Dealing River ** [ Ac ]
Villain1 shows [ As, Js, 9h, 2h ] two pairs, aces and jacks.
Villain1 shows 7,5,4,2,A for low.
Villain2 shows [ 6d, 5d, 6c, 3d ] a straight, three to seven.
Villain2 shows 6,5,4,3,A for low.
Hero shows [ 4h, 6s, 2s, 3h ] a straight, three to seven.
Hero shows 5,4,3,2,A for low.
Villain1 wins $1.27 from side pot #2 with two pairs, aces and jacks.
Villain1 wins Lo ($1.27) from side pot #2 with 7,5,4,2,A.
Hero wins $4.62 from side pot #1 with a straight, three to seven.
Hero wins Lo ($4.62) from side pot #1 with 5,4,3,2,A.
Villain2 wins $13.33 from the main pot with a straight, three to seven.
Hero wins $13.33 from the main pot with a straight, three to seven.
Hero wins Lo ($26.66) from the main pot with 5,4,3,2,A.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is -EV the whole way. When you play a hand like 23xx, ur looking for an A on the flop with another low for the low and that is it. If you put the initial raiser on A2xx, then ur low is no good and ur drawing to 3 outs (if ur lucky). You then have odds to call on the flop if u have the nut flush draw and they are high cards, however u r now playing for half the pot and are only getting ~4:1 on ur money and u dont even have the nut flush draw. this is a terrible -EV play and u r very very lucky that u didnt get chopped. what do u think people have when there is an all in and a call? You think ur flush draw is even live, a lot of times that will be dead. Just fold this, simple as that. I dont understand the push there either, they will both call u if they are betting/calling pot.

At PLO8 $25, people are moving-in constantly with bare low or bare flush draws. If I could see their hole cards on the flop though, I certainly would have to fold, since someone else already have a made straight.

That being said, this will go in the books as lucky 3-outer.

See below hand as a reference to normal hands at $25, I tried to make a steal on the turn, and yet somehow managed to scoop.

#Game No : 3048080482
***** Hand History for Game 3048080482 *****
$25 PL Omaha Hi/Lo - Thursday, November 17, 00:13:18 EDT 2005
Table Table 65322 (Real Money)
Seat 2 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 1: tomsnake ( $25.25 )
Seat 4: reppn311 ( $14.30 )
Seat 5: AmourOfGod ( $38.55 )
Seat 7: tomahawk1 ( $48.58 )
Seat 9: LeeLay ( $23.65 )
Seat 10: Hero ( $11.13 )
Seat 6: Daredevil424 ( $24.61 )
Seat 3: Villain ( $27.13 )
Seat 2: pleasanthill ( $23.75 )
Villain posts small blind [$0.10].
reppn311 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Js Kh 3s 2h ]
AmourOfGod folds.
Daredevil424 calls [$0.25].
tomahawk1 folds.
LeeLay folds.
Hero calls [$0.25].
tomsnake calls [$0.25].
pleasanthill calls [$0.25].
Villain calls [$0.15].
reppn311 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 6h, Jh, Ac ]
Villain bets [$0.50].
reppn311 calls [$0.50].
Daredevil424 folds.
Hero raises [$3.45].
tomsnake folds.
pleasanthill folds.
Villain calls [$2.95].
reppn311 folds.
** Dealing Turn ** [ 6s ]
Villain checks.
Hero is all-In [$7.43]
Villain calls [$7.43].
** Dealing River ** [ 6c ]
Villain shows [ 3h, 4s, 2s, 5h ] three of a kind, sixes.
Hero shows [ Js, Kh, 3s, 2h ] three of a kind, sixes.
Hero wins $22.61 from the main pot with three of a kind, sixes with king kicker.
There was no qualifying low hand.

[jthegreat]

You had a good high and were probably facing two lows. I see nothing wrong with it. His flush draw is <35% to hit since you hold two spades already.

I was gambling that no one had 36xx or 68xx, and was clearly wrong.

I guess my hand would be much better heads-up, as opposed to 3-way.

[Chamonyx]

Initial call pre-flop looks fine - you have a well coordinated hand. After the max raise and one call you should have let this go: It looks like at least 2 aces are in other players' hands, you are out of position to the raiser and your hand can only stand a lot of heat if you hit a good flop - and you really want to see an A, preferably the As or Ah.

On the flop: Not a bad flop for you....if you are not getting an A then this is about as good as you could hope for: low board, str8 (altho only 2nd best) and 2 of your suit. I would be tempted to bet out here...if V1 has a weak AA then he will probably fold. If he has a good A2 then he will probably raise and get rid of V2. Of course, if you are up against A268 then you are in trouble.

Now when you check and V1 pots and V2 calls then I think you have missed your chance and you are in big trouble and should go home....you have a second best hand for high with no re-draws and a draw to nut low (with probably only 2 outs) against 2 opponents who are not showing any weakness.

So I think your play was pretty horrible all-round, eclipsed only by the play of V2. I feel very sorry for V1 who I think played it perfectly.....but still lost. We've all been there [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Villain1 potted it pre-flop with A29Jss pre-flop, no counterfeit protection at all.

I guess he wanted to get it heads-up.

[jthegreat]

There's nothing wrong with that.

[gergery]

Your first call preflop is fine. Your second call preflop is a bit loose but ok, depending on how willing to gamble you are, and how badly your opponents play postflop.
If you do hit an Ace, then your opponents will have top pair and bad opponents have trouble getting away from that. Personally, with position, I would err on the side of calling here. I also prefer more than one opponent, because you are hoping for a spot where they both have low and you get high.

Once you get that flop, you have 2nd nut straight with weak flush redraw, and the 3rd nut low. Which means that heads up you are almost always going to get at least half. Even 3-way you have good chances. I probably call the turn and jam most rivers.

With their actual hands, you had 25% equity on the flop, so your $15 jam on the flop stood to win $44, making your play EV neutral. Give your opponents other hands like A2s or A2QQ and you have much better equity.

I think you played it on the looser end preflop but fine overall

-g