KQ suited, Heads-up

Dagger78 · #1 10-11-2005, 12:20 PM

Been awhile since I posted a hand. I think this one turned out well but I played poorly (at first I thought it was genius). What did I do wrong? Villian has played 2 of 15 hands, can't tell you anything about him really.

PokerStars 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, 3 folds, UTG calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (7.50 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, MP1 checks, Hero bets, UTG raises, MP1 folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG calls.

Turn: (6.75 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks.

River: (6.75 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero raises, UTG calls.

Final Pot: 10.75 BB

felix83 · #2 10-11-2005, 12:47 PM

What was your thinking 3 betting the flop and then slowing down on the turn? Were you trying for free cards to help you? Seems unlikely he'll c/r you again, and if he was trying to buy it with A-x you might get him to fold with a turn bet. But this is the kind of hand that I never know how to play. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

crazygoose · #3 10-11-2005, 12:50 PM

I kinda like it. I'm not sure if three betting for the free card is always worth it though. I usually just call that cr and fold the turn unimproved.

Dagger78 · #4 10-11-2005, 12:56 PM

Checking the turn is where I think I screwed up. If I'm going to 3-bet the flop I need to continue with a turn bet right? In retrospect, I think I should have called the flop and folded turn UI.

Is the river raise ok?

felix83 · #5 10-11-2005, 01:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is the river raise ok?

[/ QUOTE ]

On this board, he's either betting out because he has you beat, or because he thinks you have garbage due to your turn check, and has a weak hand. But with the Q river, it's unlikely he would still be that confident with, say, A-9 to bet again. The only hands he could realistically be holding that he'll call your raise with are KJ or AJ (and with AJ he might have raised PF) or maybe JT (might not play UTG) or QT. Anything else that he's betting here with either has you beat, or won't call another bet so there's no point in raising.

I don't think there's enough value in raising. I call, but would have bet had he checked again.

Fat Nicky · #6 10-11-2005, 01:19 PM

I dislike the flop 3-bet, I don't think our draw is strong enough here for attempting a free card play. and with no read, I don't think our fold equity is not enough to 3-bet the flop and betting the turn in hopes that the villain will fold.

As the hand was played, I would just call the river, but I could see why that may seem weak. I can't figure out an good argument that says not to raise. UTG could have easily bet thinking a pair of Js is good with the turn checking through, and there is a good chance he will pay of a raise.

TheMainEvent · #7 10-11-2005, 01:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
As the hand was played, I would just call the river, but I could see why that may seem weak. I can't figure out an good argument that says not to raise. UTG could have easily bet thinking a pair of Js is good with the turn checking through, and there is a good chance he will pay of a raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the river is good. A lot of players will autobet the river with virtually anything after the turn check and will probably be suspicious enough to pay off the raise. I don't see hero losing this hand unless its QJ

The Goober · #8 10-11-2005, 02:15 PM

I think 3-betting the flop is fine, but I wouldn't do it every time - its a good way to mix up your play, I think. Hypothetically you have 11.5 outs (4 outs for the gutshot, 6 overcards, 1.5 for the BDFD) - even discounting the overcards outs some, this is a pretty good spot to semi-bluff if you can get villain to fold something like 9T, or less likely, a J. A lot of players automatically put every PF raiser on AK and think that any pair is good until an A or K comes.

If I 3-bet the flop, I'd probably bet the turn. I think that even if you just called the flop, folding the turn UI is absurd. That second 4 is a very good card for you - the hand I'm most scared of from villain is J9, so the board pairing may have just cleaned up your overcard outs. Even getting 5.5:1 (the pot would be smaller if you hadn't 3-bet the flop) now way I'm folding with 10 probable outs.

Likewise, I like your river raise (with the way that hand went down). I think that after you checked through the turn, villain will be confused enough to call here with lots of worse 2-pair hands (again, J9 is my guess).

W. Deranged · #9 10-11-2005, 02:32 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Checking the turn is where I think I screwed up. If I'm going to 3-bet the flop I need to continue with a turn bet right?

[/ QUOTE ]

No!

Once you get check-raised on the flop, you are almost certainly behind at that point. Usually, players who check-raise the flop in short-handed pots have hands with which they have no intent to fold, particularly on innocuous turn cards like this one. Your fold equity on the turn is thus very, very small, and you should instead be disciplined and take the free card that you intended to buy.

I actually sort of like how you played this hand. The flop three-bet is questionable, but is very good if you feel your opponent is passive enough to not cap and not donk-bet AND you have the discipline to take the free card. If you just call the flop check-raise and are bet into, what is your plan? You should probably peel, but it's nicer to check behind and take the free card.

One reason I like the free-card approach here is that your hand is not A high and hence is lacking showdown value. When you check behind on the turn, your opponent will often bet into you on the river; this is tough with a hand like AK because you are often forced to call in a very marginal situation to avoid being bluffed out. The fact that I feel no need to call the river if I miss encourages me to want to take a free card on the turn (as does the fact that we have nothing to protect with a bet).

The other questionable point is clearly the river raise. It's certainly very, very thin, and is going to be pretty dependent on a couple of things:

1. Will your opponent pay off with a weaker hand like a pair of Js?

2. Will your opponent bet this river with less than top pair?

3. Are you concerned about getting bluff-raised (you need to be folding to a three-bet here)?

And so on.

I like it... nice hand.

Fat Nicky · #10 10-11-2005, 02:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]
One reason I like the free-card approach here is that your hand is not A high and hence is lacking showdown value. When you check behind on the turn, your opponent will often bet into you on the river; this is tough with a hand like AK because you are often forced to call in a very marginal situation to avoid being bluffed out. The fact that I feel no need to call the river if I miss encourages me to want to take a free card on the turn (as does the fact that we have nothing to protect with a bet).

[/ QUOTE ]

This is quite intriguing.