Inappropriate Remarks at the Poker Table - Page 9

baggins · #81 11-12-2003, 04:16 AM

the reason that somebody would dare to bring religion to the holy green felt is because their Faith compels them to share what they see as good news with other people.

they mean it as no harm.

how can it possibly hurt you to have somebody tell you that their God loves you? at the very worst, it is an empty statement if you don't believe in all that. how on earth can that be considered offensive?

why is it that the mere mention of the name Jesus makes people so defensive? nobody bats an eyelash at the name Buddha, or Vishnu, or Mohammed, or Moses, or Abraham, or Gilgamesh... but say the name Jesus Christ and people want to rip your eyelids off and fondue them with the blood of virgins...

Gamblor · #82 11-12-2003, 09:58 AM

For Muslims, it got moved Friday. I am not so educated about Islam, but I believed it was for the simple reason that they wanted their own day, not the same day as Judaism and Christianity.

For Jews, it's Saturday and has been since day 1.

ArchAngel71857 · #83 11-12-2003, 12:14 PM

I was unaware Jesus changed the Sabbath to Sunday. I thought that early Christians started worshipping on Sunday because that was the day of the resurrection (the day after the Sabbath. Unless I am mistaken (and please tell me if I am) Jesus never outright changes the Sabbath day. I know many times where he gets in trouble from the Pharisees for "working on the Sabbath."

Also, Since you are Jewish, I was wondering if you are familiar with the column Tuesday Morning Quarterback that used to be on ESPN.com. The writer got fired for making some "Anti-Semetic" claims. Was wondering if you read them or how they were interpreted from a Jewish perspective.

-AA

HDPM · #84 11-12-2003, 01:13 PM

Well, in this country people are more comfortable saying "Jesus loves you" than something about Allah or Mohammed or whomever, so you see it more. And typically Jews don't proselytize so they are not going around saying "Observe the Commandments and you'll be happier." So in this country it is mostly Christians who would say something like that in public. And like it or not, many people see it as offensive. Saying it can be interpreted as calling their beliefs into question or insulting them if they don't believe. I will assume this guy meant well and all, so I wouldn't get all bent out of shape about it. I would prefer, however, if people refrained form this kind of talk in public. And I admit I get somewhat uncomfortable when people talk about religion when they don't know me or the context is wrong. One example, I had a life insurance person come to my office uninvited. (We had previously met at her office and discussed some insurance options.) In addition to barging in, she started talking about how God affected her decisionmanking on something or another. Yeah, she meant nothing by it, but it was inappropriate in the context. Whatever her religion is, which I am assuming is some form of Christianity, although I am not sure. Religion is a personal deal and you have to be a little reserved in terms of who you talk to about it. And even then there are limits that you have to think about, depending on how well you know the person and the context of the discussion, etc...

RollaJ · #85 11-12-2003, 01:32 PM

[ QUOTE ]
For Jews, it's Saturday and has been since day 1.

[/ QUOTE ]

I beg to differ, I believe it was from day 7 (or day 6 in the evening) [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Gamblor · #86 11-12-2003, 01:36 PM

Unless I am mistaken (and please tell me if I am) Jesus never outright changes the Sabbath day. I know many times where he gets in trouble from the Pharisees for "working on the Sabbath."

This certainly puts some doubt into my mind, but I always accepted my position as fact, having grown up in the religious Jewish day school system. I lead a somewhat sheltered life in terms of other religions. We were always taught to think along the lines of: Gentiles believe what they believe, and we believe what we believe. But don't let them convince you you are wrong, and don't try to convince them.

In fact, anyone forcibly converted to Judaism is not considered a real Jew. They have to convert of their own free will, without solicitation. Further evidence that radicals like Jews for Jesus are not Jewish.

Also, Since you are Jewish, I was wondering if you are familiar with the column Tuesday Morning Quarterback that used to be on ESPN.com. The writer got fired for making some "Anti-Semetic" claims. Was wondering if you read them or how they were interpreted from a Jewish perspective.

As far as Easterbrook goes, I think ESPN was more interested in maintaining good viewer relations, and they overestimated the sensitivity Jews have in detecting anti-semitism. Frankly, I'm so used to it I don't care. Being an ex-patriate Israeli, I see so many lies and crap floating around about Israeli policy that it makes it impossible to argue.

That being said, I don't see any reason why he needed to bring up the fact that Eisner and Weinstein are Jewish at all.

What does their Jewishness have to do with the violence in Kill Bill? The problem is not his specific anti-semitism - it's a societal problem, where from day one (and this is only partially self-inflicted) Jews are Jews, not Americans, Canadians, etc. etc.

I'm reminded of a quote by Franz Grillparzer, the Austrian author:
"Finally and long overdue, your people, oppressed and disgraced by hatred and maliciousness, have achieved justice: now you enjoy full citizen's rights, but you'll remain Jews nonetheless."

You want to know why many Jews are always on the lookout for anything remotely anti-semitic?

The Canary in Europe

ArchAngel71857 · #87 11-12-2003, 02:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Unless I am mistaken (and please tell me if I am) Jesus never outright changes the Sabbath day. I know many times where he gets in trouble from the Pharisees for "working on the Sabbath."

This certainly puts some doubt into my mind, but I always accepted my position as fact, having grown up in the religious Jewish day school system. I lead a somewhat sheltered life in terms of other religions. We were always taught to think along the lines of: Gentiles believe what they believe, and we believe what we believe. But don't let them convince you you are wrong, and don't try to convince them.

In fact, anyone forcibly converted to Judaism is not considered a real Jew. They have to convert of their own free will, without solicitation. Further evidence that radicals like Jews for Jesus are not Jewish.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, i was interested if you had anything in the NT or otherwise to use to support your statement. I am fairly positive (but open to discussion and debate) that he never outwardly says "stop the sabbath on saturday and move it to sunday." funny about the comment that it has beensince day 7.

About easterbrook, my main concern was that ESPN fired Easterbrook for comments on Michael Eisner (CEO of Disney, parent company of ESPN) and not so much for his comments on Judiaism. Because it was a blog, i don't think he had time to reread what he wrote and edit it to more clearly get his point across. he was deeply apologetic and i think genuine. I know this NFL season is suffering with the absence of TMQ. I also think that with the recent Rush Limbaugh huzzah, ESPN reacted quicker than they would have if Rush hadn't dhappened. thanks for you valuable input.

-AA

phish · #88 11-12-2003, 03:03 PM

Compared with all the other things that are said at a poker table (swearing at dealers, criticizing opponents, inappropriate talk during a hand), if all everybody ever sau was something to the effect of 'God Bless', we'd have a very nice poker environment. And I'm an atheist.

ChipWrecked · #89 11-12-2003, 03:30 PM

I was taught by the Methodists that the Christian Sabbath was moved to Sunday because of the Resurrection.

Also, I believe it's in The Late Great Planet Earth the author posits that the rebuilding of the Temple will trigger the seven-year countdown to Armageddon.

felson · #90 11-12-2003, 04:54 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I was taught by the Methodists that the Christian Sabbath was moved to Sunday because of the Resurrection.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, this is correct. Jesus did not personally change the date of Sabbath observance; this was a decision of the early church.

[ QUOTE ]

Also, I believe it's in The Late Great Planet Earth the author posits that the rebuilding of the Temple will trigger the seven-year countdown to Armageddon.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just want to observe here that not all Christians support this view (though many do, mostly American Christians).