Is it good to stay in the red zone?

[betgo]

Sometimes I think it is advantagous to maintain an M of 5 or less. That way, you can make EV+ pushes with marginal hands and more EV+ pushes and calls with big hands.

I don't think it is necessarily worthwhile to make marginal pushes with like 9xBB with a small ante or no ante. If I get blinded down, I will have better opportunities.

Some will say you can't win a tournament as a small stack. However, a lot of daily live tournament and online tournaments on some sites have fast structures so that everyone at the final table is short stacked.

Of course you don't mind doubling up and becoming a bigger stack. However, as a medium stack, you have to more wait for big hands. As a short stack or a small stack, you can play more aggressively.

[LearnedfromTV]

Yeah, why be at 10xBB when you can be at 5x and double up. Beta-testing something for your guide?

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, why be at 10xBB when you can be at 5x and double up. Beta-testing something for your guide?

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course it is better to be at 10xBB than 5xBB, but you can't make many plays with 10xBB, so it may not be worth a lot of risk to gain or maintain that stack. Without a big ante, 10-20xBB is not the easiest stack to play. I am serious.

i know that any time i get out of the red zone i like to raise then fold the flop when checked to me to be sure to get back there fast

[LearnedfromTV]

You're confusing easy to play with having greater EV. It's easier to play a shorter stack because you have fewer options.

[pfkaok]

[ QUOTE ]
What? I have a psychology project due that week and 2 midterms? Oh its no matter, you bitches are finished.

(I just won't sleep for a week)

[/ QUOTE ]

you're simplifying. you have MORE +EV options when you're in red IMO.

[LearnedfromTV]

[ QUOTE ]


you're simplifying. you have MORE +EV options when you're in red IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Even if you're right (and you're only right if you're opponents don't know how to play against a small stack) , more +EV moves from the 5BB chip stack than a 12BB chip stack doesn't mean your total tournament EV is greater. It can't be - the extra chips in the 12BB stack have intrinsic value.

[Exitonly]

Oak, thats the second time you've quote from another post.

Get your act together.

edit: you've edited it since then, so i look stupid. But i stand by what i said

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
You're confusing easy to play with having greater EV. It's easier to play a shorter stack because you have fewer options

[/ QUOTE ]

You have more opportunities to play wiht 5xBB than 12XBB. With 5xBB, you only push, whereas with 12xBB, you can limp, raise, or push. But limping and raising are not great plays with 12xBB unless you have a big hand. Your best move with 12-15xBB is to push on a resteal.

[pfkaok]

[ QUOTE ]

Quote:
You're confusing easy to play with having greater EV. It's easier to play a shorter stack because you have fewer options



You have more opportunities to play wiht 5xBB than 12XBB. With 5xBB, you only push, whereas with 12xBB, you can limp, raise, or push. But limping and raising are not great plays with 12xBB unless you have a big hand. Your best move with 12-15xBB is to push on a resteal.

[/ QUOTE ]

well. i think i might be the only one agreeing with you betgo... but i think there is a lot of merit to this idea, and i had actually thought of it a while ago but never too deeply.

sometimes i use this theory to make thinish aggressive plays at times. hard to think of one of the top of my head, but say if you're in a spot where a semibluff push might be very close to breakeven EV, but your HU and you have the villian covered. so if you push and get called and lose you'll be in the red zone... if you push and they fold your stack is VERY healthy, and if you push, get called and hit you have a monster stack. IMO, its worth it taking gambles in those types of spots.