An idea (ATTN: Bison)

[joker122]

The difference is the MHS rarely get posts/questions that are boring and routine (i.e. should I raise [insert premium hand] out of the blinds, or I've got [insert statistically insignificant number] hands, what do these numbers mean?) The MHS doesn't have nearly the problem we do.

[Michael Davis]

"Should I love up"

That topic belongs in the Other Other Topics forum.

-Michael

[ElSapo]

Joe..

The problem really isn't the converter, though taking it offline would at least (probably) mitigtate the problem short-term. Look the the mid-high forum -- it is having the same problems.

2+2 is grownig rapidly, and as other moer experienced posters have said before, each new poster here feels like they're breaking new ground.

I have no solutions. It's cool by me to take down the converter for a week or whatever. But ultimately, I don't thion it's the real problem.

I do agree with the poster who said this forum has gone downhill. Perhaps the problem is that this was inevitable.

ElSapo

EDIT -- I was drunk when I wrote this. Sorry for typos. The reference to mid-high stakes: I think they use the coverter less, but are still being taken over by basic posts.

Still drunk.

[Blarg]

I've been in internet communities of different sorts before, and there is always an effort to close them down sooner or later. Sometimes it's well-intentioned, sometimes snotty, but in communities like this one, it's especially important that things remain open and friendly and that people use things like the converter and go run around loose.

That's because it's the same newbies who annoy or overwhelm the forums are the ones who are keeping poker strong today and building its future. We need them, in every way from the legislative pressure their numbers and influence may eventually provide to the simple raw cash they provide.

And even if you're at a high level where they don't provide their cash directly to you, those newbies feed the guys who DO make it to your level one day and help feed you, or...some of them even get up there eventually directly and feed you, for which we should all be grateful.

New poker players may be a hassle, but they're an incredible resource for all of us. Chasing them away, making them feel unwelcome like some of us do with tons of snotty answers, that kind of thing, only helps put out people's desires to play poker and get into the poker milieu, whatever that might mean.

Many communities fight hard to close themselves down, and they very often suffer for it. Poker is clearly the kind of thing you want everyone in on, even the fools. Heck, maybe especially the fools. These, and maybe their kids eventually too, are the guys who are going to be writing your paychecks far into the future -- open the doors and say welcome. Even if you're not in the mood sometimes. They're the best thing that ever happened to poker even if you don't know it.

[Joe Tall]

Take down the covertor for one week. One. See what happens.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[detruncate]

Can some of the problem be traced to the fact that people seem to make SS their home longer than other forums? From what I've heard, there doesn't seem to be a high-quality logical 'next level' to graduate to. In Micro, people look forward to SS. Does anyone look forward to posting in Mid-high?

I've spent some time around Micro, and have asked some pretty silly questions. Some of you were kind enough to provide answers or point me to where I could find them for myself. Now I'm frequently one among several who is playing this role for others.

Before too long, I hope to be spending much of my time around SS. In the mean time, I make a point of trying to help the new Micro posters. I also try to respond to the posts made my people who have been around a while. They seem to do the same. It works out reasonably well, all things considered.

I can understand why you cats would get frustrated answering the same sorts of questions that a brand new Micro poster would ask. I bet that most of you would like to have left that sort of thing behind you, and I don't blame you. But is it really as big a problem as it's made out to be? Threads by forum regulars seem to get a reasonable number of responses. In fact, this has led to talk of cliquishness. I'm not in a position to talk more about this, so I'll leave it at that.

People don't tend to aspire to 'barely tolerated' status. A revival of the FAQ Bison started some time ago would probably help clean things up a little... as long as it's super easy to find. At least as easy as posting questions.

A further split between limits might also help...though as people have pointed out in the past, you don't have to take a test before you're allowed to play higher. Add categories like 'beginner' and 'expert' and how likely do you think it is that people will post anything but stupidly obvious questions in beginner? Who would you rather have review your stats if you're interested in that sort of thing?

The people who hang around a while tend to get the hang of things pretty quickly. Those who don't, don't. What can you do besides make it as easy as possible for them to learn forum etiquette?

I'm not sure that an opinion from someone on the outside looking in is either welcome or useful, but there you go.

[MicroBob]

because I'm waiting for my allergy medicine to kick-in so I can go to sleep I decided to look into some of this stuff a bit further.

I compiled all of the threads that were posted in the last 24 hours in SS. These are threads that were posted between 4:30a (eastern time) Oct 6 and 4:30a Oct 7. If a thread was started before 4:30a but received responses after that time it didn't count. I figure this balances out each night. I'm just looking at the number of new threads for a 24-hour block.


Because it's late and I'm feeling the effects of my medicine I am not responsible for the accuracy of my numbers. Analyze at your own risk.


Make what you will of these numbers (or don't).
I don't really think the SS forum is in such bad shape that it needs 'fixing' per-se....but I don't believe these numbers support or counter that belief.
If you think these numbers are persuasive for your ideas on how to make the forums better one way or another then that's dandy.

I honestly don't know if ANY of this info is useful in the least.


I counted 56 threads that were basic HH's posted in the past 24 hours.
And I counted 14 threads that were topics other than basic HH's.


Of the 56 HH threads, the average number of replies was 5.9.
There were 13 HH threads that received 10 or more replies.

Of the 56 HH threads, 40 of them contained subject-lines that at least partly explained what kind of hand it was.


Of the 14 threads that weren't HH's, the average number of replies was 10.6.
There were 2 threads that received zero replies and one thread that received 75 replies. The average number of replies for the 'other' 11 threads (more than 0, less than 75) was 6.7....3 of these threads received 10 or more replies.


Here's the complete list of 56 HH threads and number of replies in parenthethees.
I shortened some of the titles....but only used info from the actual title of the thread itself. IOW, I did not go into the HH to get details on the hand...I am just shortening the info that was given about the hand in the subject line.
In cases where I give no title I decided the info given in the subject line was either too vague or was cutesy so that it was impossible to tell. I often had to look into the thread to make sure it was actually a HH.


Stop and Go (6)
(13)
(3)
(5)
(2)
AK (14)
AQ lost on turn (3)
BB special vs. TAG (1)
Bluff (10)
JJ in BB (6)
(1)
(8)
99 button (7)
TPTK laydown on flop (11)
KK (4)
2nd nut on river (4)
river raise? (8)
overcards (1)
flop 2-pair, raising war (2)
JJ vs overcard (4)
underpair heads-up (14)
(9)
AQs (10)
(1)
turn bet on C/R (23)
QQ BB (0)
(3)
KJs button (17)
(5)
blind defense hand (4)
protect hand here? (7)
TT (1)
AKs SB (3)
AQo CO (12)
CC2 with turned trips? (3)
AKs flush draw heavy action (6)
(8)
top pair NK (2)
(5)
river decision (10)
(18)
JJ overpair heavy action (4)
(6)
QQ SB (3)
T9s CO, St8 on river (25)
folding JJ? (9)
QQ (9)
Overplayed KK (2)
QQ again (9)
(19)
AKo TPTK (6)
AJs (1)
AJo SB 2-pair scary board (10)
Cap PF? (6)
(3)
J9s BB (1)


Here's a list of the non HH threads:

2/4 vs. 3/6 (8)
table selection at .5/1 (3)
diary of a newbie - 5 month checkup (15)
raises no respect (2)
table selection 2/4 (10)
seek input from those moving up from micro (13)
private table invite (1)
whiskey's Don't Scare the Fish (0)
PF close decisions (2)
AQo 3-bet PF (9)
Party PFR standards (4)
An Idea - Attn Bison (75)
HH's without reads (0)
Suggestions for hand posting (7)

[daveymck]

The site is more popular and so you get more posts.

The standard advice given to newer players is post some hand histories now people complain cos they do.

This forum is quite a cliqy (cant spell) one anyway hands posted by certain people get more replies etc than some by unknown posters and I suspect there may well be some of the unknowns posting more intertesting hands. There has been a rash of pissing contests by some of the regulars to post their stupidest wildest hands none of which were to really discuss strategy.

The forum will develop itself over time lots of posts at times not a lot at others. The main danger here is that some of the older regular posters think its their forum it aint, and in any forum where this happens the newer people who have just as much right to post feel they cant cos of the regulars.

The convertor is not the problem here.

[crockett]

You said the two key words that will solve this entire situation.

1. Moderators
2. Sub-Categories

I used to spend a lot of time at a website that used the same forum software and went through some of the same growing pains that this site is seeing.

You take Small-Stakes and divide into your favorite 3 or 4 Sub-Categories and moderate it well and this all goes away.

The challenges:

1. What are those categories? Possibly Pre-Flop, Flop, Post-Flop, Non-specific Hand Relate, Misc? I don’t know but just some thoughts.
2. This one is the biggie and the hardest to overcome. Moderators. They end up becoming slaves to the forums. They do crappy jobs like constantly moving posts because they are in the wrong category, constantly deleting posts because they didn’t use the hand converter w/ a friendly message referring them to the FAQ on how to post, they used a poor searchable title, etc.

Of course I make it sound easier than it is but this would solve everything.

The site I used to frequent is still going strong and it really a pleasure to visit.

[Tosh]

The problem is that people then just post those disgusting uneditted hand histories. I say ban anyone with less than 5000 posts from posting here. ;/