So I'm At The Pistol Range Saturday... - Page 7

slamdunkpro · #61 08-23-2005, 10:53 PM

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Accuracy reaches the point of diminishing returns when you can hit a six inch target at any distance.

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Not so, if I practice to the point where I consistently shoot one ragged 3 shot hole at 5 yards in a practice situation, then with repetition over a reasonable time, I can learn to do it quickly. Shot groups increase exponentially under high stress. A ½ inch grouper’s shots might go to 6-8 inches at 3 yards in a real gunfight. A six inch grouper’s might go to 25 – 40 inches under the same circumstances.

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That means at contact distances you should be able to make a center-of-mass accelerated pair from the holster in under 1 second

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No human I know of except maybe Cal Eldritch or Ernie Hill could react to a stimulus, draw from a concealed rig, and perform this exercise in under one second. The truth in handgun fights is that the guy who draws first, or already has their gun out wins 99% of the time.

If both parties go to cover, then accuracy skills come into big play.

One point that I will make regarding the OP is that you should not train to shoot one shot then check your placement unless you’re shooting competitive bull’s-eye slow fire. Shoot several shots, and then check your accuracy. Remember, you fight like you train.

DasLeben · #62 08-23-2005, 11:24 PM

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In this world, all human beings can be classified as wolves, sheep, or sheepdogs.

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I like this quote. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

UseThePeenEnd · #63 08-24-2005, 01:24 AM

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This is a flaw in your training.

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Ease up, big fellow.

I teach kids shooting occasionally, beginning with rimfire rifle, then rimfire pistol, and Shoot-N-C makes it fun for them. Im not training them for IDPA. I shot some before they arrived, and after they were through I fired off my carry ammo at THEIR final target with the results reported in the OP.

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The par time for a trained shooter is 2 rounds, center-of-mass, from concealment, on a man-sized target 7 yards away, in under 2 seconds.

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I'm aware of the standard. I can do this with my Seecamp from 5 yards, and it does not have sights of any kind. With the Para I also manage to get by.

Sponger15SB · #64 08-24-2005, 01:31 AM

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You know, I'm pro-gun and all, but what the [censored] are you guys doing that you need to be carrying a gun around?

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That was pretty much what I'm thinking. I really feel sorry for Das because his life is like this....

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In this world, all human beings can be classified as normal, or completely paranoid crazies

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FYP

Sponger15SB · #65 08-24-2005, 01:34 AM

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Well it is a very real scenario that you should protect yourself against if you do open carry.

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I don't disagree with this

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I don't consider myself paranoid, but rather just cautious if I have a gun out in public.

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It seems to me that you'd be more likely to get yourself killed open carrying, also, I find it hard to believe you actually need to carry a gun with you.

DasLeben · #66 08-24-2005, 01:53 AM

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I find it hard to believe you actually need to carry a gun with you.

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I get this argument a lot. My answer: I don't need a gun with me. If I'm walking down the street with my gun on my hip, it's not necessary whatsoever to have a gun at that particular time. However, I'm fully prepared if a situation ever comes up to where I actually do need my gun.

Does that answer your question?

EDIT: Maybe a better way to answer this is to give you a scenario. Two guys are coming at you with baseball bats and you have no way of running away. How is it you're going to defend yourself?

Sponger15SB · #67 08-24-2005, 02:06 AM

I don't know how you could say these two things together

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I don't need a gun with me. If I'm walking down the street with my gun on my hip, it's not necessary whatsoever to have a gun at that particular time.

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Maybe a better way to answer this is to give you a scenario. Two guys are coming at you with baseball bats and you have no way of running away. How is it you're going to defend yourself?

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UseThePeenEnd · #68 08-24-2005, 02:08 AM

A sidearm is like a tuxedo.

The need for one is an extraordinary rarity, but when it comes, absolutely nothing else will do.

DasLeben · #69 08-24-2005, 02:54 AM

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I don't know how you could say these two things together

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I don't need a gun with me. If I'm walking down the street with my gun on my hip, it's not necessary whatsoever to have a gun at that particular time.

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Maybe a better way to answer this is to give you a scenario. Two guys are coming at you with baseball bats and you have no way of running away. How is it you're going to defend yourself?

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I'm not quite sure what you're getting at, but perhaps I should have made myself more clear. I simply stated that you don't need a gun except in rare situations, one of which might be two guys coming at you with baseball bats.

I would like an answer to my question, however.

Sponger15SB · #70 08-24-2005, 02:57 AM

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I would like an answer to my question, however.

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You already know the answer.

But how about you answer this question (and then we can continue to ask stupid questions to each other till someone walks in my house and shoots me):

You're walking down this street and someone pulls a knife on you and demands for your wallet, you pull out a gun and shoot him and his friend walks up behind you and slits your throat. Now, don't you wish you had just given him your wallet instead of dying?