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#61
08-29-2004, 10:35 PM
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Results
I called the flop bet. The turn was the J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], so the board is K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
He bet, I called. The river was the 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. He bet, I called. He showed A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], and I won. Two things: 1. I think calling is CLEARLY the best play on the flop. Folding is way too weak... especially on Party, the BB will bet a flop like this with all sorts of hands. Naked aces, small pocket pairs, or even weaker hands. He might of course bet with a king or a deuce, but he often checks those hands. Your effective odds to the river are 4.5-to-2.5, so you need to win about 35-40% of the time to show a profit. You have the best hand here far more often than that... as much as 70-80% of the time I'd guess. Since this is a "way ahead or way behind" situation, you will also finish with the best hand about that often. Raising is counter-productive. It tends to slow down a bluffer, and it just causes you to go off for two extra bets against a real hand. Even if you get 3-bet, you can't fold, which brings me to... 2. No folding! Any of you that included the word "fold" as any part of your answer... raising the turn and folding to a 3-bet... betting and folding to a check-raise, etc., I think you are wrong. I played a similar situation the day before, but (for various reasons) I decided to raise the turn instead of just call. My opponent 3-bet me.... with AJ, no pair, no draw. This is not an isolated occurrence. You have to be REALLY careful about folding in these spots... especially on Party. In fact, if you suggested raising and folding to a 3-bet, you are almost certainly getting bluffed out of hands needlessly. 
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#64
08-29-2004, 10:40 PM
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Re: Common Party $3-$6 Situation
[ QUOTE ]
I'm amazed how many responses this has gotten. This is the easiest fold in the world... (I'm going to look pretty stupid if I'm wrong) it's a tiny pot, it's a 100% uncoordinated board, and you have 2 outs when you're behind. this hand is a perfect example of why the check-call, check-call, bet line is great in these situations (if you have a K). betting out gives any pocket pair below QQ an easy opportunity to fold, and gets you trapped by AK, AA, or KK, which will pop you on the turn. [/ QUOTE ] I really hope you're not being serious about folding. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] Folding is horribly weak-tight, imo.
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#66
08-29-2004, 10:50 PM
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Re: Results
Ed-
Your response is what most of us suspected of course. As a side note I want to give you a 'cyber' pat on the back for the way you explain situations that come up at the table. After reading SSH and then going back to my study of TOP I feel like I am reading a different language.
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#67
08-29-2004, 10:51 PM
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Re: Common Party $3-$6 Situation
"I really hope you're not being serious about folding. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] Folding is horribly weak-tight, imo."
If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times: SThief09, you're too weak-tight.
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#68
08-29-2004, 10:53 PM
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The other upside to this line of play...
You get to bust out the "Shhh, I'm stacking your chips" line after the BB calls you a "Moron calling station" for the next ten hands. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]
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#70
08-29-2004, 11:00 PM
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Re: Results
I meant to mention that too. SSH is an extremely readable book. Enjoyed it very much for that reason alone.
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Linear Mode
