A conversation w/ daryn re: being a teacher

[MikeNaked]

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I'm pretty sure you'd need to get certified, though. I'm not quite sure of the certification process for people without education degrees.

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here is what i could never stand to be a teacher: all these strict rules and general bs. An education degree? That sounds like a complete waste of time. The procedure for being a teacher is too mechanical. I think that all of this nonsense weeds out all of the creative people.

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i think i agree with you in general about this

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Ok, maybe you can tell us what is this 'nonsense' he's talking about....

Usually people think "good teaching" is the way they learned best in high school. There's lots to it - from curriculum to instruction to assessment to learning theory.

There's nothing stultifying about an education degree from a quality program IMO.

[kurosh]

If you really want to be a teacher, you can teach me about poker.

[Homer]

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Me: "started teaching HS math in the fall (taking a 1/3 pay cut in the process) and hate that as well. I teach the lowest level classes in a bad school district. My students (10th and 11th grade) don't know that 1.5*10 = 15, 1/2 = 0.5, etc."

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Oh man, you sound like me. I quit my engineering job and started teaching HS math last year, taking about a 1/3 pay cut. I'm in a bad district and taught the lowest level classes last year, and stepped up only half a notch this year ([sarcasm]all Algebra I, woohoo [/sarcasm]). The kids are incredibly unintelligent and couldn't care less about learning. The few that do care ask ridiculous non-math questions that make we wonder where the hell they've been for the last 15 years, such as...

"What's a vowel?"

"Is Connecticut part of New York?"

When it comes to math, they're just as bad. I've spent 5 minutes with students, on more than one occasion, to explain why 1/2 of 2 is 1, why 0.8 is not the same as 8, why we do problems with negative numbers, and so on, and so on, and so on. It never ends.

My co-workers aren't much better, which astounds me. I was in the lounge with another math teacher, who was working through a worksheet before going over it with his class. On of the problems said to write a function for the series "2, 8, 32, ..." He couldn't freakin do it. Basic geometric series, ar^(n-1). And they give him Algebra II, Geometry, Pre-Calc, etc. There's another teacher (full-time sub) who couldn't pass the Praxis II in three attempts. NJ doesn't exactly set the bar very high compared to other states, either. Bah. That's enough venting.

[Homer]

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Me: "started teaching HS math in the fall (taking a 1/3 pay cut in the process) and hate that as well. I teach the lowest level classes in a bad school district. My students (10th and 11th grade) don't know that 1.5*10 = 15, 1/2 = 0.5, etc."

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Oh man, you sound like me. I quit my engineering job and started teaching HS math last year, taking about a 1/3 pay cut. I'm in a bad district and taught the lowest level classes last year, and stepped up only half a notch this year ([sarcasm]all Algebra I, woohoo [/sarcasm]). The kids are incredibly unintelligent and couldn't care less about learning. The few that do care ask ridiculous non-math questions that make we wonder where the hell they've been for the last 15 years, such as...

"What's a vowel?"

"Is Connecticut part of New York?"

When it comes to math, they're just as bad. I've spent 5 minutes with students, on more than one occasion, to explain why 1/2 of 2 is 1, why 0.8 is not the same as 8, why we do problems with negative numbers, and so on, and so on, and so on. It never ends.

My co-workers aren't much better, which astounds me. I was in the lounge with another math teacher, who was working through a worksheet before going over it with his class. On of the problems said to write a function for the series "2, 8, 32, ..." He couldn't freakin do it. Basic geometric series, ar^(n-1). And they give him Algebra II, Geometry, Pre-Calc, etc. There's another teacher (full-time sub) who couldn't pass the Praxis II in three attempts. NJ doesn't exactly set the bar very high compared to other states, either. Bah. That's enough venting.

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This is how out of it I am. I didn't even realize you were quoting me when asking your friend about his job. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[KaneKungFu123]

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I'm pretty sure you'd need to get certified, though. I'm not quite sure of the certification process for people without education degrees.

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here is what i could never stand to be a teacher: all these strict rules and general bs. An education degree? That sounds like a complete waste of time. The procedure for being a teacher is too mechanical. I think that all of this nonsense weeds out all of the creative people.

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i think i agree with you in general about this

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, maybe you can tell us what is this 'nonsense' he's talking about....

Usually people think "good teaching" is the way they learned best in high school. There's lots to it - from curriculum to instruction to assessment to learning theory.

There's nothing stultifying about an education degree from a quality program IMO.

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i think an education degree is good if you are teaching dumb kids. if you are teaching smart kids it seems like a waste of time. all you need to do is rent 4 or 5 teacher movies and follow the inspirational techniques they use. seriously, do you go to school for 4 years to learn 'teaching format'??

[Michael Davis]

"That's how I think of it. At high school, the students are there because they have to be, and it often shows."

Oddly, I think is untrue at most of the good schools. Having them try hard to get grades is way overboard. Some just don't care, and that's bad. The ones that care care TOO MUCH. They obsess over grades, they challenge them, and they don't actually care about what they're learning, just about how well that little piece of paper will be able to get them that nice wellpaying job where they can be pretend kings and queens.

-Michael

[TimM]

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This is how out of it I am. I didn't even realize you were quoting me when asking your friend about his job. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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There's a reason it sounded so familiar. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I added the link to the quote because I was worried others would think I was talking about myself there, but looks like you started your reply before I finished editing.

[Homer]

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I'm pretty sure you'd need to get certified, though. I'm not quite sure of the certification process for people without education degrees.

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here is what i could never stand to be a teacher: all these strict rules and general bs. An education degree? That sounds like a complete waste of time. The procedure for being a teacher is too mechanical. I think that all of this nonsense weeds out all of the creative people.

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i think i agree with you in general about this

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Ok, maybe you can tell us what is this 'nonsense' he's talking about....

Usually people think "good teaching" is the way they learned best in high school. There's lots to it - from curriculum to instruction to assessment to learning theory.

There's nothing stultifying about an education degree from a quality program IMO.

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His post makes some sense if you are willing to take it with a grain of salt. There are definitely some teachers who don't know their subject matter, but are there anyway because they have an education degree. And there are definitely some incredibly intelligent people who would like to become teachers, but cannot because they don't have an education degree. That's a shame, because many of these people know their subject inside and out, have experience using the subject in the real world, and have original ideas for conveying the subject to students. It's a shame that the fact that they don't have an education degree is holding them back from entering the profession. Luckily, a lot of states have alternate route programs now, so it's a little easier for career changers. All that being said, having an education degree is certainly not worthless, and I don't think that's what KingKungFuMaster was saying.

[daryn]

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I'm pretty sure you'd need to get certified, though. I'm not quite sure of the certification process for people without education degrees.

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here is what i could never stand to be a teacher: all these strict rules and general bs. An education degree? That sounds like a complete waste of time. The procedure for being a teacher is too mechanical. I think that all of this nonsense weeds out all of the creative people.

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i think i agree with you in general about this

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Ok, maybe you can tell us what is this 'nonsense' he's talking about....


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the way i took it was there are so many hoops you have to jump through to become a teacher, and some really qualified people might just say F it

[Blarg]

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"That's how I think of it. At high school, the students are there because they have to be, and it often shows."

Oddly, I think is untrue at most of the good schools. Having them try hard to get grades is way overboard. Some just don't care, and that's bad. The ones that care care TOO MUCH. They obsess over grades, they challenge them, and they don't actually care about what they're learning, just about how well that little piece of paper will be able to get them that nice wellpaying job where they can be pretend kings and queens.

-Michael

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At least they're motivated. I would never look askance at that. Who cares if there's nothing cosmic behind it? I'm not sure if there really should be, anyway.

I do think one of the primary purposes and values of school is not to teach you this or that subject, but to teach you how to think, and work hard, and value working hard, at stuff where the gratification is delayed. Being able to do so is actually the blueprint for success for virtually every endeavor. It's what adult life is all about. Working hard to succeed isn't a bad thing, and is something that definitely should be learned as kids, before it really tears up your life if you don't know how to do it.