Going pro Article

[Sniper]

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Please don't try and equate being a full time internet poker player with being a poker pro. Just becuase some of you can multitask and play a bunch of games at once and make a living out of it doesn't mean that you are truly a professional poker player.

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I will very humbly suggest that anyone that can successfully be profitable 12-tabling 6-max games on the internet playing 1200 hands/hr is far more of a pro than someone sitting in a B&M playing 40 hands/hr.

[TimM]

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Where you've all mentioned playing 3/6 and 5/10 you mean NL right???

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No, we mean limit.

Lets say you've got a B&M 5/10 limit player making 1BB/hr - $10/hr.

Now let him play 4 tables online. You get twice as many hands per hour per table, so that's 8 times as much, so theoretically he can make $80/hr. In reality he will lose some of his edge playing 4 tables. But he will gain about $2 per raked pot won in reduced rake and no tip, and about $12.50/hr in rakeback. This all together could add about $30/hr to his win rate, but let's call it a wash because of his reduced edge. Even if you're only half as good as this guy, you can still make a decent hourly rate at these games.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Please don't try and equate being a full time internet poker player with being a poker pro. Just becuase some of you can multitask and play a bunch of games at once and make a living out of it doesn't mean that you are truly a professional poker player.

[/ QUOTE ]

I will very humbly suggest that anyone that can successfully be profitable 12-tabling 6-max games on the internet playing 1200 hands/hr is far more of a pro than someone sitting in a B&M playing 40 hands/hr.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree. In my mind all it makes you is a very good onlime gamer - no different than playing video games except you happen to be playing for money. Guys, living in your own closed off, computer controlled world is not healthy. You need to go out and see the sun and get laid. You need to come to a B&M and sit down at the table with real chips in your hand and be able to look at the rest of the table and size them up quickly. When the cocktail waitress with the tiny miniskirt comes over you need to be able to concentrate on your hand. You need to be able to see the anger in your opponents face after he's taken a bad beat from you and realize that he's on tilt so you can go for the kill. No, what you guys are doing is no different from shooting at aliens on your PS2. Just because a few of you make a living at it doesn't mean you can call yourselves professionals. Not until you've done it in the real world can you ever hope to claim that title.

[Sniper]

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Guys, living in your own closed off, computer controlled world is not healthy. You need to go out and see the sun and get laid.

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An online multitabler can play more hands in a few hours 1 day/month than you can play sitting in a B&M all month. Its entirely possible that they are getting alot more sun than you are.

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You need to come to a B&M and sit down at the table with real chips in your hand and be able to look at the rest of the table and size them up quickly.... You need to be able to see the anger in your opponents face after he's taken a bad beat from you and realize that he's on tilt so you can go for the kill.

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Wouldn't a player able to size up the other players at the table without seeing their faces be even more of a pro.

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When the cocktail waitress with the tiny miniskirt comes over you need to be able to concentrate on your hand.

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When your naked girlfriend comes up to you at the computer and you click the sit out button... sounds better to me!

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Not until you've done it in the real world can you ever hope to claim that title.

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How many WSOP winners that qualified online will it take before you are convinced that playing online is the real world [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

The world has changed, embrace it!!

[StellarWind]

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Please don't try and equate being a full time internet poker player with being a poker pro.

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Online poker and B&M poker are different games. So is golf. To say that someone who is making a big income playing online poker is not a pro is just silly. If you want to say that online poker is not poker ... well online poker is different. That doesn't make it better or worse.

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Guys, living in your own closed off, computer controlled world is not healthy.

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This on the other hand is truly silly. Online poker is a much healthier lifestyle if you want it to be:

1. No driving. Driving is one of the most dangerous things we do.

2. Sensible food from my own kitchen versus overpriced and often unhealthy casino food.

3. No carrying around large amounts of money and possibly being attacked.

4. Plenty of free time to exercise.

5. Lots of time with wife and kids instead of chasing cocktail waitresses and socializing with drunks and compulsive gamblers.

6. Less stress due to losing streaks because the online player typically plays a lot more hands but at lower stakes.

7. No smoke.

8. Nice, properly-adjusted, ergonomic chair instead of whatever the poker room has available.

9. Less germs.

Actually this may be your point. Being a full-time B&M player is such an unhealthy lifestyle I'm not sure I could tolerate it for very long. So maybe they are the "real" pros [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img].

[PokerHorse]

oh, i didnt realize that. thanks

[PokerHorse]

i love it. The whole point of this post was that it is irresponsible to promote the idea that 50k is no big deal multi tabling 3-6.
here is what i know and what the publishers of this site know. that people will continually look for the "Holy Grail", of how win at poker because of the nature of the game and the swings. It doesnt matter how much"Discipline",
game-theory, statistical knowledge, etc etc you have.
95% of you dont have the mental ability to cope with the downside of this game.PERIOD! Do you buy every poker book that comes out, just so you dont miss something new as far as strategy is concerned? Are you constantly in search of the"Correct starting hands for various game types? Are you searching for that optimal strategy out of the blinds?
if so, you are not even close to being ready for a pro career at poker. Do you feel that in order to win a poker tourney, you cant do it without HOH volume 1 and 2 ?
Folks, its not that these are bad books, it's just that, that isnt what you ultimately need to handle this game.
Many of the top pros have major gambling problems, substance abuse problems, etc etc. But its this disregard for money that actually helps them succeed at the poker table.
if on the internet a 200-300 bb swing is common place, then a negative swing of 1200 big bets is very possible.
but when this happens, the player to whom this happens will be out of the game well before it gets to that point.
its just the nature of being human. many of the ring pros who have made it had enough money before they started.
So, if you still want to go pro or are playing for a living now and you are winning, please keep in mind that it wont always be this way. if you are considering this, make sure you have plenty of money, because even if you have the ability to return to a job, it will be difficult becuse you will keep telling yourself, "just one more try". also get a mentor, .. someone who is actually doing it to help. good l;uck to you all, you will need it

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When your naked girlfriend comes up to you at the computer and you click the sit out button... sounds better to me!

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That's so funny. Don't try and be something you're not. Most of you online players are 250-500lbs of pasty skin flab. Sure, you may have a girlfriend - but she'll be the beached whale type so it doesn't really count. I'm really laughing pretty good at your weak attempts to sound like big shots.

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1. No driving. Driving is one of the most dangerous things we do.

2. Sensible food from my own kitchen versus overpriced and often unhealthy casino food.

3. No carrying around large amounts of money and possibly being attacked.

4. Plenty of free time to exercise.

5. Lots of time with wife and kids instead of chasing cocktail waitresses and socializing with drunks and compulsive gamblers.

6. Less stress due to losing streaks because the online player typically plays a lot more hands but at lower stakes.

7. No smoke.

8. Nice, properly-adjusted, ergonomic chair instead of whatever the poker room has available.

9. Less germs.

[/ QUOTE ]

1. No driving. Driving is one of the most dangerous things we do.
--Only if you don't know how to drive.

2. Sensible food from my own kitchen versus overpriced and often unhealthy casino food.
--If that were really true except we all know it isn't. I know your pizza delivery bills are a lot more than my free casino food (free becuase I am a club member so every time I sit at my NL table for a few hours I earn enough points to eat free for days if I want to). And my menu choices are huge and contain many healthy items.

3. No carrying around large amounts of money and possibly being attacked.
--I just deposit it in my casino bank and take withdrawels when I want to. This is the big city. No one is going to try and jack me for a few thousand or if they do it would be hard since the freeway entrance is right around the block.

4. Plenty of free time to exercise.
--Ahhh hahahahahah. C'mon please? Don't even try and fool anyone with that line.

5. Lots of time with wife and kids instead of chasing cocktail waitresses and socializing with drunks and compulsive gamblers.
--IF you were actually married AND had actually fathered kids. We both know that the percentage of online players that have done this is very low. And I guess sitting at your computer all day or night playing for cash wouldn't be considered compulsive? Would it?

6. Less stress due to losing streaks because the online player typically plays a lot more hands but at lower stakes.
--Losing is losing. Playing more hands only means that when you do hit your losing streak it will be faster and deeper than a B&M player.

7. No smoke.
--Smoking in casino's here in LA has been illegal for years.

8. Nice, properly-adjusted, ergonomic chair instead of whatever the poker room has available.
--So you can sit in your chair for 8 - 10 hours? Even with an ergonomic chair that is unhealthy.

9. Less germs.
--OK. That's the only point I'll concede a little bit. Poker chips and cards do have germs. Most of us get around that by washing our hands every now and then. BTW, when was the last time you cleaned your keyboard and mouse? Has anyone but you used them? Have they sneezed? Have they picked their nose and then typed something?

[ QUOTE ]
i love it. The whole point of this post was that it is irresponsible to promote the idea that 50k is no big deal multi tabling 3-6.
here is what i know and what the publishers of this site know. that people will continually look for the "Holy Grail", of how win at poker because of the nature of the game and the swings. It doesnt matter how much"Discipline",
game-theory, statistical knowledge, etc etc you have.
95% of you dont have the mental ability to cope with the downside of this game.PERIOD! Do you buy every poker book that comes out, just so you dont miss something new as far as strategy is concerned? Are you constantly in search of the"Correct starting hands for various game types? Are you searching for that optimal strategy out of the blinds?
if so, you are not even close to being ready for a pro career at poker. Do you feel that in order to win a poker tourney, you cant do it without HOH volume 1 and 2 ?
Folks, its not that these are bad books, it's just that, that isnt what you ultimately need to handle this game.
Many of the top pros have major gambling problems, substance abuse problems, etc etc. But its this disregard for money that actually helps them succeed at the poker table.
if on the internet a 200-300 bb swing is common place, then a negative swing of 1200 big bets is very possible.
but when this happens, the player to whom this happens will be out of the game well before it gets to that point.
its just the nature of being human. many of the ring pros who have made it had enough money before they started.
So, if you still want to go pro or are playing for a living now and you are winning, please keep in mind that it wont always be this way. if you are considering this, make sure you have plenty of money, because even if you have the ability to return to a job, it will be difficult becuse you will keep telling yourself, "just one more try". also get a mentor, .. someone who is actually doing it to help. good l;uck to you all, you will need it

[/ QUOTE ]

Excellent points. I agree with you that most of these online gamblers who have experienced some success for a few months or a year or so think that they will always be so succesfull and it's just not true. They are spending all their time online and a few of them are putting away 12-15k profit (after all living expenses) BUT they are not building any skills that will help them succeed in the real world. That profit they have can go very, very quick with the kinds of multitable hands some of them play. Most of them will also burn out in a few short years and even the ones with 30-45k in the bank then will see how fast this can be depleted with no other source of income.

If they try and take their profits and go pro in the B&M they will realize very quickly how unprepared they really are. Oh, there's no doubt that a few will have success but the vast majority will fail miserably - just like every other person who has gone pro over the years.

Meanwhile, those of us who play in B&M but are not doing it full-time as pros have real jobs where we can advance our careers, have real interactions with people, put away money in 401k's or have pension funds, etc. In short we have real lives and we get to enjoy our poker.

I also agree with you that the majority of poker pro's are cumplusive gamblers and many of the most well known names have had huge money swings - even more so in the past 2 years when the tournament money has become so huge.