Another Slotboom Misconception

[Your Mom]

[ QUOTE ]
I own many 2+2 books and will continue to purchase them because they are quite valuable to me.

But the way Sklansky and Malmuth conduct their message board blows my mind. I've been active on dozens of Internet message forums and mailing lists (covering a variety of subjects) since 1990. This is the only one I've ever seen where the moderators actually start threads for the sole purpose of inciting a personal argument.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know, isn't it the best?

[d1sterbd]

[ QUOTE ]
However, here's a hint: For a tell to be important it must not only be accurate, but it must change the way you would play your hand. For instance, if you have a tell that someone is bluffing, but you were going to call anyway, then the tell has no value.


[/ QUOTE ]

I can see your point about a tell not being worth much when deciding to call a bet on the river. However, at times a tell might make you want to bet or raise when you otherwise would not have. I know that you use the disclaimer that the book was written for games where a lot people see the flop, but even in these games you will find yourself heads up or three handed where a tell can make a difference in a hand.

[DavidC]

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Everyone:

Even though I believe that Rolf Slotboom is sincere in what he writes, in my opinion he is confused. Here's another example from his SSH review:

[ QUOTE ]
I found the section on tells rather disappointing. If what the author says is indeed true ("Small stakes games are usually rife with tells", p. 244), then he should have discussed this more into depth, rather than just saying that there's plenty of information on this subject available elsewhere.


[/ QUOTE ]

He has this completely wrong, and I thought it would be interesting to let others comment on it. That is you can either agree or disagree with me.

However, here's a hint: For a tell to be important it must not only be accurate, but it must change the way you would play your hand. For instance, if you have a tell that someone is bluffing, but you were going to call anyway, then the tell has no value.

Best wishes,
Mason

[/ QUOTE ]

... true, and thanks for pointing that out. I can't remember exactly, but did Ed bring that up in his book?

I'm kinda curious why you're bothering to write that here, though. We're your fanclub, so to speak (your company's, at the very least), so it's not like you have to defend yourself to us...

Who the f- cares what Slotbloom writes about you guys and your books? Relax man.

[BluffTHIS!]

[ QUOTE ]
Who the f- cares what Slotbloom writes about you guys and your books? Relax man.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mason has already made the points why:

1) He has to defend any incorrect charges of inaccuracies in 2+2 writings;

2) He has to defend against writing that impugns the integrity of 2+2 authors, which snidely asking how DS would know something is;

3) He holds other poker writers to higher standards of accountability.

[Mason Malmuth]

Hi Mom:

Just for your information, we have conducted all of Two Plus Two in our own way. Over the years I have received much advice from many people supposedly in the know about how to run our business. If I had listened, Two Plus Two, if it still existed, wouldn't be close to where it is today.

Thanks for the support.

Best wishes,
Mason

[Mason Malmuth]

Hi Bluff:

There's also a fourth reason. It's our policy at Two Plus Two to steer our readers to that mterial which is good and away from that material which is bad.

Best wishes,
Mason

[johnc]

The point I'm seeing in this thread regarding tells in small stakes games was IMHO completely missed by Rolf and partially missed (based upon his words) by Mason, that being tells are of only tiny, if almost worthless value in low limit games. Miller has stated throughout SSHE that success at small stakes games comes from taking advantage of the weak and confused. How can a "tell" from a confused player be of any value whatsoever when they themselves have absolutely no clue in the world what they are doing in the first place. Rolf, I believe takes the viewpoint of a player more familiar with higher limits and the mentality associated with it - his criticism of SSHE in the reagrds reflects this perspective.
Mason's perspective, on the otherhand, was partially lost behind the defensive stance taken with respect to the criticism presented by Rolf. I do not in any way doubt his expertise in tells but was somewhat taken aback and left rather dumbfounded by the attack that he put forth that seemed more dripping with biting sarcasm and less informative on this very interesting topic. Many of the posters reflected this opinion. That's my 2 cents.

[grimel]

[ QUOTE ]
I've been active on dozens of Internet message forums and mailing lists (covering a variety of subjects) since 1990. This is the only one I've ever seen where the moderators actually start threads for the sole purpose of inciting a personal argument.

[/ QUOTE ]

Give me a break, on at least half the forums dealing with competative areas the mods abuse the daylights out of their mod powers. Mods getting ticked at each other and the forum owner(s) probably accounts for 1/4-1/3 of the new forums created.

These two (David and Mason) are pikers by comparison.

[MicroBob]

pikers??
(me confused)



I see Mason's point about wanting to defend his site and his books...etc etc.
Obviously I have thoughts on how he could better do this at times, but it is just a matter of opinion and he is correct when he makes statements such as 'others telling us how to run our business.'

It's true. I've never run a book-publishing company....and the situation that they are in is different than many other 'regular' book-publishing companies in that they are committed to excellence in a field that has a lot of competition as well as misinformation out there.


If Mason did it 'my way' (or anyone else's way) then things would be different. This is obvious.

I hope he accepts my occasional criticisms in the positive light which they are intended. That being that I have mucho mucho respect for David and Mason (and Ed and rest of 2+2) but that I just see a few things that I would personally do differently.

I know there's no way to know whether I am right in my opinions or not and I also know that regardless of what I may think Mason is obviously going to continue to do whatever he believes to be in the best interest of 2+2.

[Mason Malmuth]

Hi Bob:

Your criticisms are fine. We have never taken them negatively.

Best wishes,
Mason