Will Rove Resign?

[adios]

No anger and hositility from the Democrats? C'mon.

[BCPVP]

Ugh, I'll try to make this the last post. Hopefully you'll understand, or just drop it b/c you aren't getting it.

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It would seem pretty stupid to think that someone criticizing less then 1/10 of 1% of a group, criticizing them for specific misdeeds, if criticizing the other 99.9%.

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To many of the offended, what was done (A/C etc)is probably not considered wrong.

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Perhaps people should calm down and try to look objectively at what he said.

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C'mon, kurto. You know the comparison was totally without proportion. I think people are just as angry that Durbin compared these interrogation techniques to what the Nazis, Soviets, and Khmer Rouge did to civilians. You can spin what Durbin said all you want, but whatever defense you have will sound like spin.

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I mean the whole notion of "criticize one person, you criticize everyone." I like the cop example. Say a cop murders his wife. Do you think all the cops should stick up for him simply because he's a cop? If someone in the military did something wrong, his wrongdoing should besmirches the military more then someone criticizing that individual.

Is this not common sense?

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You're taking the example farther than the incident we're talking about. Let me go the opposite direction. Would a football team be justifiably angry if a rival coach called a few of those on this football team a bunch of retards?

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Come on. I'm NOT saying no there can't be a black person with a large penis. The stereotype is that black men are well endowed. ie.. as a race, they have larger penises then white men. When studied, they've found NO differences between races. ie... if you took 50 white men, 50 black men and 50 asians... they'd all be about average. There's NO statistical difference. So, the stereotype that Black men have large penises is completely a myth.

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Depends on who you ask. Contradictory statistics

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But it is simply wrong to say that all stereotypes are based in truth.

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You're twisting my words. I said stereotypes have an element of truth to them, not that they're based on it.

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Its quite easy for stereotypes to develop within the mind of an individual or a group based on nothing more then a person's first impression of ONE person. That person then extrapolates that the SINGLE person they met represents ALL people of that class. Then, whenever they see anything that supports that stereotype, they note it and allow it to reinforce the stereotype. Anything that contradicts the stereotype is ignored.

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I've covered this. In Psychology, this is called the confirmation bias and it is relevant when discussing stereotypes. This still doesn't invalidate the notion that stereotypes have an element of truth to them. What you're arguing against is when people begin applying the stereotype to all of those within the group.

Perhaps this will help you understand what I'm talking about: "In modern usage, a stereotype is a simplified mental picture of an individual or group of people who share certain characteristic (or stereotypical) qualities."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereotype#Psychology

Oversimplified does not mean it is wrong, just that it is oversimplified.

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A perception can be right or wrong.

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No sh*t. Read the statement again. Simply b/c YOU don't accept someone else's perception, doesn't invalidate it.

On a final note, is there some Freudian reason why you're obsessed with the black man's penis example...? J/K with ya , Kurto.

[kurto]

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To many of the offended, what was done (A/C etc)is probably not considered wrong.


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If they think what was done was just playing with air conditioning, then they're ignorant.

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C'mon, kurto. You know the comparison was totally without proportion. I think people are just as angry that Durbin compared these interrogation techniques to what the Nazis, Soviets, and Khmer Rouge did to civilians.

[/ QUOTE ] I have said numerous times that I thought it was hyperbolic and over the top of Durbin to go to the Nazi comparison. That's not what I'm debating. What I'm saying is he CLEARLY wasn't indicting all of the military. He was only indicting the people accused of mistreating the prisoners.

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You're taking the example farther than the incident we're talking about.

[/ QUOTE ] How so? Durbin criticized a small group of soldiers accused of mistreating prisoners and the spin is that he criticized ALL the troops. See the difference?

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Would a football team be justifiably angry if a rival coach called a few of those on this football team a bunch of retards?


[/ QUOTE ] I don't know... why did he call them a bunch of retards? Did the few 'retards' get drunk and try to rob a bank? If the few did something retarded and shameful, the the football team should call them retards as well.

I see there are contradictory results for penis size. I give you that one! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

That only shows I made a bad example: how about these:
"blondes are dumb"
"a group of teenagers in a store must be shoplifting"
"a man can't be faithful to a woman."
etc.

As I said, there have been numerous studies on stereotyping. stereotypes are actually measured by their accuracy. They've studied the root of stereotypes. Some are based on observable characteristics while some are based simply out of prejudice.

Many Democrats hold the stereotype that Republicans are bigots. Would you argue that there has to be some truth to this... that the Republicans are the party of bigots?

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This still doesn't invalidate the notion that stereotypes have an element of truth to them.

[/ QUOTE ] SOME stereotypes do. Some don't. Its that simple.

Let's do an example:
Let's say that I hate Lithuanians. I tell everyone that I meet that Lithuanians were more likely to be rapists then Americans. You've never met a Lithuanian. You accept my statement as being true. You now hold the stereotype that Lithuanians are rapists. Yet, it is based on nothing but my say so. There is no truth to what I've said. Yet I've spread it around and other people have accepted it. Then, in the news, there is a story of a Lithuanian rapist. Now, we've all been given a little more fodder. It may turn out that Lithuanians have the lowest incidence of rape in the world. But since most people don't look it up, the myth is never dispelled. Instead, we continue to perpetuate it and the stereotype gets stronger.

There are many stereotypes based on something real. But I don't see how you can say all stereotypes are based in reality.

If so, you'll have to accept a lot of bad things about republicans: they're less educated, largely: racist, fascist, violent, hypocrites, dishonest, etc. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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On a final note, is there some Freudian reason why you're obsessed with the black man's penis example...?

[/ QUOTE ] lol We can't all be like Dick Cheney! (I don't know if you saw the infamous picture)

[andyfox]

Yes, but it is understandable for the "outs" to be angry and upset. Not so for the "ins."

Maybe it's just that the right is more prominent on talk radio so I hear them more.

[Utah]

Niether of his statmenets are false even if there is a bit of political banter in them.

Durbin's words are played on al Jezeera and I think it is quite clear that the democrats have zero interest in helping the president win the war in Iraq.

Second, the democrat leadership saw 9/11 as a law inforcement issue. Additionally, democrats think in terms of, "why do they hate us so much?". Republicans think in simplier terms, "you are our enemy and we will kill you".

[trippin bily]

Complte parrot revisionist history.
What vote does the president get in these matters parrot??
Kerry literallty DID vote for the bill and then voted against it.
No lies.It happened that way.
Polly want a cracker???

[kurto]

Wow, Trippin just proved he is truly more ignorant then Jaxmike. Honestly, you're more ignorant then your average high school dropout.

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What vote does the president get in these matters parrot??


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You see, ignorant lying moron, the President has something most adults have heard of, its called veto power. In this particular case, Bush said he was not going to sign the Bill into law unless it was changed. Once it was changed, he agreed to pass it.

Its hard to imagine one being as stupid as you, and yet here you are! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

More proof that you're borderline retarded:
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Kerry literallty DID vote for the bill and then voted against it.


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They were two DIFFERENT bills. He voted FOR one bill, but rejected a DIFFERNT bill because of how it was financed.

How can you be as ignorant as you seem? Do you have to actively TRY to be as ignorant or does it just come naturally? Inquiring minds want to know.

[kurto]

Laughable.

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Durbin's words are played on al Jezeera and I think it is quite clear that the democrats have zero interest in helping the president win the war in Iraq.



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It must be 'clear'... after all, you said so.

I think its clear that Republicans are lying crooks. Its gotta be true because I think its clear.

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Second, the democrat leadership saw 9/11 as a law inforcement issue. Additionally, democrats think in terms of, "why do they hate us so much?". Republicans think in simplier terms, "you are our enemy and we will kill you".

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Democrats fully supported the efforts in Afghanistan. Why do Republicans feel the need to misrepresent everything?

Anyone with half a brain realizes that there ARE root causes of terrorism. "Know thine enemy." Only a fool would not analyze all aspects of the situation. Its so funny to see republicans reinforce the "think less shoot more" mentality. These are the people who create more enemies for America.

[hetron]

Utah's analysis of the situation is typical. I had no idea the Democrats were supposed to be lapdogs of Bush and "support the war in Iraq". Durbin's comments were on Gitmo, not Iraq. But of course, details are unimportant to the Republicans. It's the whole 3rd grade gang mentality of "whoever isn't with us is against us"

[kurto]

Yep.

This reinforces what I've been saying... when Dean slanders all Republicans, he is wrong and the right gets outraged.

If Rove does the same thing, they all support the statements.

I've actually been saying how both Dean and Rove are wrong for these divisive statements. Perhaps I'm wasting my time. I should just take the Republican approach and just parrot whatever Dean says and accept the truth of it while wildly denying the same kind of rhetoric when a Rove says it.

That way, we can all be at the same level, that is, like a bunch of 12 year olds calling each other names in the school yard.