Ethical thing / best hand not winning at showdown - Page 5

Blackdirt12 · #41 06-29-2005, 05:53 PM

I haven't read the responses, but I'd open my mouth. I was in a hand once where I made a flush on the river to beat two pair. I turned over my spades, which the dealer didn't recognize as a flush, and my opponant said "two pair", and flipped over his cards. The player on my left said something to me like "nice river" and I looked over to him confident the pot was mine, and didn't pick up that the dealer had awarded the pot to the two pair...luckily a guy on my right realized what was going on right before I did and spoke up before the dealer mucked my cards...if he hadn't said anything I think my cards would've hit the muck before I could stop him, so when I see a mistake, even if I'm not in the hand I'll speak up.

bernie · #42 06-29-2005, 06:14 PM

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I haven't read the responses, but I'd open my mouth. I was in a hand once where I made a flush on the river to beat two pair. I turned over my spades, which the dealer didn't recognize as a flush, and my opponant said "two pair", and flipped over his cards. The player on my left said something to me like "nice river" and I looked over to him confident the pot was mine, and didn't pick up that the dealer had awarded the pot to the two pair...luckily a guy on my right realized what was going on right before I did and spoke up before the dealer mucked my cards...if he hadn't said anything I think my cards would've hit the muck before I could stop him, so when I see a mistake, even if I'm not in the hand I'll speak up.

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And you'd be clearly violating a main rule of cards if you did that in the OPs hand. What is so hard to understand about that that some in this thread don't get that? Better yet, why not reach over and table his cards for him? What's the difference?

You do understand the difference between your situation and the hand the OP described? There is a huge difference between tabling your hand, and not tabling it. One invokes the cardspeak rule. The other, clearly, doesn't.

b

AKQJ10 · #43 06-29-2005, 06:29 PM

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It's not the 3-seat guy's fault the 8 seat guy can't just table his hand. Much less, actually read a hand that's tabled.

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You're right: it's not his fault that 8-seat mucked. It is his fault that he was shooting an angle, if that was the case.

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt; maybe he really didn't notice the board was 4-suited or for whatever reason he wanted to declare his queen high. But that's not the most likely case.

steamboatin · #44 06-29-2005, 07:42 PM

How can declaring your hand be an angle shoot?

He had a queen and He said queen. The other player made a mistake when He mucked the winner. I have done it, and probably anybody with more than two posts has done it also. You soon learn to table your cards.

AngusThermopyle · #45 06-29-2005, 07:49 PM

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I haven't read the responses, but I'd open my mouth.

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Do yourself a favor. Read the responses. You might learn something.

jedi · #46 06-29-2005, 08:36 PM

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It's not the 3-seat guy's fault the 8 seat guy can't just table his hand. Much less, actually read a hand that's tabled.

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You're right: it's not his fault that 8-seat mucked. It is his fault that he was shooting an angle, if that was the case.

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People really need to stop suggesting that this was an angle shoot. The opponent mucked his hand intentionally. He didn't intend to toss them face up, have it hit an edge and land face down. He didn't accidentally toss them into the muck when fumbling with the cards to turn them face up. He mucked his cards. He willingly forfeited the right to the pot.

BigBaitsim (milo) · #47 06-29-2005, 08:47 PM

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Cards were tabled, and clueless dealer and involved players didn't see the proper low because it was a low board with lots of counterfeiting in both hands. Since I wasn't in the hand, I took the STFU approach and let it go.

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I think that you had a responsibility to speak up.

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Once tabled, it is everyone's responsibility to correct any dealer errors. I posted a month or two ago about a 2/4 hand I played with Mrs. Milo at Canterbury. Dealer awarded the $39 pot to a player, and I realized mid-deal of the next hand that it should have been a chop. Dealer called over the floor, they recreated the hand and the floor took the $39 from the player. They then ran back the tape, came back 20 minutes later and chopped the pot.

TomBrooks · #48 06-29-2005, 09:01 PM

I don't say anything at the table, before or after the cards are mucked. If there's one thing I've learned in life, it's to mind my own business.

bernie · #49 06-30-2005, 02:21 AM

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It's not the 3-seat guy's fault the 8 seat guy can't just table his hand. Much less, actually read a hand that's tabled.

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You're right: it's not his fault that 8-seat mucked. It is his fault that he was shooting an angle, if that was the case.

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People really need to stop suggesting that this was an angle shoot. The opponent mucked his hand intentionally. He didn't intend to toss them face up, have it hit an edge and land face down. He didn't accidentally toss them into the muck when fumbling with the cards to turn them face up. He mucked his cards. He willingly forfeited the right to the pot.

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Even if it was an angle shoot, you have to table your hand. Let them angle shoot all they want like this. Cardspeak, baby!

b

bernie · #50 06-30-2005, 02:23 AM

I mentioned this in another response but I think it's a great question to illustrate why you don't open your yap during this situation.

If you're going to speak up before the player mucks and the player didn't table his hand, why not just take the cards from the dolt and table them yourself? Would that be wrong? How do you think that would go over if you did that? It's the same thing.

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