best baseball player ever?

[tdarko]

its not cheating, it happens all the time (minor leagues now). that was just an old school way of playing.

in spring training this year a man that played against him later in his career was telling us old stories about these guys. he is like 90 years old but man he looked better than most of our coaches.

anyway getting an edge isn't cheating. a runner on second that picks up the catchers signals and relay's them to the hitter isn't cheating either and its done all the time. a third or first base coach that catches a catcher not closing his legs far enough when giving the signals and sees them and relays them to the hitter isn't cheating either but its done.

i just said that the degree of getting your edge is what matters, obviously bonds took it too far but so has tons of others in the league.

[HDPM]

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As for who would be the best player if every player in the history of baseball played right now, it's Bonds. It's no where near close either.

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can we get them all juiced up for the competition?

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Well, I think we should adjust the eras. OK< Ruth didn't have to face African American pitching because of the racism. One thing Bonds has tougher. But should we bring Bonds back to hit the dead ball. Pitchers pitching off a higher mound. A huge strike zone. No ridiculous armor, no batting helmet. We will pretend Bonds wouldn't stare at a home run then be killed by a pitch his next at bat, we'll just know he wouldn't crowd the plate and wouldn't draw so many walks.


Or should we move Ruth to this era. Mix some weights and roids into his hot dog and beer diet. Let him wear all the armor. With roids Ruth might have more bat speed than bonds and still use his 52 or 54 ounce bat or whatever. And I bet Ruth could pitch middle relief at least.

The time warp is impossible. but I think Ruth wins. Particularly if you assume Bonds has done steroids, which to me invalidates all his records if you think he has domne them

[MarkL444]

matt anderson

[tbach24]

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His OBP was .609 last season. He gets on base more than 60% of the time. DISGUSTING. And his slugging is off the hook as well

yes but your post said, if they all played in this era bonds would be the best by far. i dunno man, the advances in weight training alone (not to mention his posh lifestyle) give him a huge edge over those other guys. not to mention the chemical issues.....

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Good point. However, my assumption was that it would be in the physical state that they played in. So Ruth would still be a fat drunk who could smack the [censored] out of the ball.

[bholdr]

even without it- he was swinging a 54 ounce bat for chrissakes!


lets also not forget that he would have been one of the top ten or so PITCHERS all time if he had kept that up....


all around best player ever, no doubt in my mind, and the pitching's the clincher.

[BretWeir]

If you're just talking about spotting a pitch and calling it to your teammate, I agree 100%.

Also agree 100% that Barry's juicing is way beyond this, and way out of bounds.

[jesusarenque]

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The time warp is impossible. but I think Ruth wins. Particularly if you assume Bonds has done steroids, which to me invalidates all his records if you think he has domne them

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No, it doesn't. There is no proof that steroids make you better. Besides, if pitchers are using steroids too, then that at least partially negates any advantages hitters might have.

[Jack of Arcades]

Mays was amazing and deserves to be in any dicussion of the best player ever.

I think this discussion comes down to:

1] How much, if at all, do you penalize Babe Ruth (or Wagner, or Cobb, or Hornsby) for playing in a diluted league, talent wise? Conversely, how much do you credit Mays?
2] How much, if it all, do you credit Williams for time missed in the two wars?
3] How much, if at all, do you penalize Bonds for possible steroid use?
4] How important do you consider defense? Mays is likely the best defensive player of any candidate (Wagner is up there too). Williams and Ruth are probably the worst.

FWIW, I tend to throw together about 20 position players roughly of equal value in one group, and around 10 pitchers roughly of equal value on the other and much of the effort to rank them is futile.

I also think trying to transplant Babe Ruth into the modern era is a fruitless question, such as putting Barry Bonds into the 1920s (and white). The only distinction you should make between the two eras are talent levels.

[HDPM]

I think steroids completely invalidate all records. If a pitcher is caught with them, all those records should be negated too. It is like being bionic or something. And it is an obvious advantage.

What is funny is that Bonds and mcgwire only hit 70 and 73 in a 162 game season in an era with miniiscule strike zones and lively balls. Shows how great Ruth was.

[mostsmooth]

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The time warp is impossible. but I think Ruth wins. Particularly if you assume Bonds has done steroids, which to me invalidates all his records if you think he has domne them

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There is no proof that steroids make you better.

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bonds' numbers are proof enough (and mcgwire and sosa as well)
more proof is why take it and risk serious health issues if it didnt help?