Give me a frop line

[buffett]

Just so you know, I haven't seen any of the other posts yet.

Based on my current crappy poker philosophy....

I would plan to c/r this flop (1) to get the coldcallers out and (2) to find out more about button's hand (i.e., does he have AsKs or Ad/c/hKd/c/h or AA-JJ).
If one of the coldcallers bets it and the button raises it back to me, I'd probably make a crying fold before I'd coldcall it.
-web

[kenberman]

[ QUOTE ]
Let's say you check-raise:

If only the button calls your flop raise, what is your turn action? Do you bet any card? What if an overcard hits, specifically an ace or king?

What if one of the limpers comes along with the button? How does this affect your turn play?

I am not content with "check-raise" because you face the callers with 2 cold. So what? At this point they are still not making much of a mistake calling with a hand like 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], unless they fear another button 3-bet.

Bump.

[/ QUOTE ]

Part of the reason for facing the field with 2 cold is to clean up overcard outs. You have a vulnerable hand, and want to decrease the damage of an overcard falling. If you get A4s to fold, then a turn A falling doesn't damage your hand at all. If you don't get A4s to fold, then a turn A kills you.

If the 2 passive villians are holding something like QJo or K8s, then your hand is damaged if any overcard falls. Every overcard you eliminate increases your EV, and the best way to do this to try to get people to call 2 cold.

[Carmine]

I don't think we are going to thin this field. The PF action has tied my players to the pot, at least in their eyes. I think a Bet/3-bet line may be best. If we can't get rid of them may as well have them donate as much as possible to make up for all the times the overs burn us.

EDIT: I'm curious why no cap PF to try and get rid of the limpers then?

[TripleH68]

Turn brings...

2 friendly cards: TT.
29 undercards: 2-8.
16 overcards: J-A.

Chances are we will like our hand much more on the turn. This is why I suggested bet/call on the flop and proceed from there...I want to get to the turn cheaply but I do not want to check this flop. I don't want two bets back to me and I don't want to be 3-bet by the button either.

More thoughts?

Am I making a simple hand too complex?

[AlmightyJay]

I, hopefully, check-raise the button.

I'm sure that's been said and discussed 1,000 times in this topic already though. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[PuckNPoker]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Let's say you check-raise:

If only the button calls your flop raise, what is your turn action? Do you bet any card? What if an overcard hits, specifically an ace or king?

What if one of the limpers comes along with the button? How does this affect your turn play?

I am not content with "check-raise" because you face the callers with 2 cold. So what? At this point they are still not making much of a mistake calling with a hand like 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], unless they fear another button 3-bet.

Bump.

[/ QUOTE ]

Part of the reason for facing the field with 2 cold is to clean up overcard outs. You have a vulnerable hand, and want to decrease the damage of an overcard falling. If you get A4s to fold, then a turn A falling doesn't damage your hand at all. If you don't get A4s to fold, then a turn A kills you.

If the 2 passive villians are holding something like QJo or K8s, then your hand is damaged if any overcard falls. Every overcard you eliminate increases your EV, and the best way to do this to try to get people to call 2 cold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ahh I didnt take the overcard outs into consideration, check-raise is the superior play.

[SteveL91]

Personally, I'd tend to put the button on a big overpair or AK. I don't see him having anything worse as he showed no respect to an UTG raise from a player who hadn't been playing many hands.

Considering the size of the pot, there's really no way to protect your hand, but I'm also not sure there's much to protect. I'm very hesitant to try for a c/r, because I think there's a very good chance the button will 3-bet you, especially since it wasn't capped pf; on the other hand, betting out gives the cold-callers 14.5:1. The question is, is that such a bad thing? Considering how marginal your hand is in this context, I think you may benefit from the most-likely dead money overlay coming from the cold callers.

It may be weak, but I don't see the need in investing a ton of money to chase what is quite possibly at best a 3-3.5 out hand, and more likely, a two out hand; all you really have is a marginal one card flush draw to go with a strong, but not dominating PP.

So, I think you either check/call the flop and see what the turn brings, or bet the flop, call a raise and fold the turn UI. I'm really loathe to play a strong hand this way in such a big pot, but I think there's just too much of a chance that you're way behind and drawing near dead to merit playing it aggressively.

[shadow29]

This is a clear c/r.

[wabe]

Sorry, you want Small Stakes...go out the door, it's the second one on your right.

After cheating and reading some of the other replies, I like the check/raise. Based on the flop 3-bet, you can assume he will bet, whereupon you raise and trap the other poor slobs for 2 cold.

I don't do this often enough. I need to add this to the bag.

[wabe]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hero checks the flop, intending to check-raise Villain and trap those in between for two cold.

[/ QUOTE ]

VotesForThis++;

[/ QUOTE ]

This is clearly suboptimal. It should be:

++VotesForThis;

I'll let others elaborate.

[/ QUOTE ]

Get real. Lumbergh would never have caught that.