Does this count as winning a fight?

[Boris]

The only answer is yes. Think about it. If you were talking smack to the little twerp, then he puts you in a headlock, maces you, and beats on you for a couple of minutes - would you go back and tell your friends about how you kicked his ass? Hell no.

[The once and future king]

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I draw a distinction between a fight and a murder. If you beat someone with a bat, its a fight. If you beat them to death, its a murder. The difference is important enough to warrant legislation.

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But this does not abswer the question of just shooting them non lethaly. If I pull a gun and incapicitate someone with it, is this the same as using a baseball bat to do the same thing. If I do so have I won a fight?

[Rduke55]

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My point is that most of the fights I've seen or been involved in are started by some drunk a-hole in a bar.

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Do you think DespotInExile is a) a myth, b) very rare, c) uncommon, or d) common?

Obviously its pretty dependent on context - and I think his quote "I will [censored] kill you" was exaggeration - but I'd say the answer is close enough to c) for me not want to take any chances, even in a place as tame as Demonbreun.

For Despot: what were the legal consequences when you sent those two guys to the hospital?

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I just caught the Demonbreun reference. I was all like "There's a street here named that!"a and then I looked at your location.

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In the case of the broken arm, the guy was arrested. (I intervened after he attacked a woman in an elevator.)

In the case of the broken knee, there was no consequence because I left the scene of the fight with him lying on the ground moaning.

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See, this is my point. You won the fight and then it was over.

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A few things.

1. I am not a criminal. I have no desire to hurt people. I dont look for fights, and I personally would not have stomped the guy's head once he's on the ground because it wasn't necessary to my survival. On the other hand, with the case of the guy in the elevator, after I took him to the ground, slammed his head into the cement a few times to stun him, and slipped into an armbar, I felt him still resist me, at which point I decided to break his elbow and end the fight. It was a very conscious decision on my part. I laid on the armbar and he relaxed--this is the sign you have good control. Then he got squirrely on me and started pulling back a little, so I decided to take his arm out of the fight just to be sure.

2. Criminals and sociopaths do exist. Fortunately, I have met very few of them. But did you watch the skateboard video I linked to? That guy was hurting people, destroying property, for fun. He's a sicko. I have no doubt he'll end up in prison doing time (if he hasn't already), but he's going to seriously hurt people along the way. Notice how quickly the violence came on. Little posturing, chest thumping. He saw an opportunity, so he clocked the guy with the skateboard. When the guy went down, he kept clocking him. Then he kicked him a few times in the head for good measure. Stuff like this happens ALL THE TIME. If you're disoriented, seeing stars, balled up on the ground, some guys will stop hurting you, but some guys will use this as the chance to finish you. In my opinion, if you're on the ground and you're stunned from having taken some hard headshots, the fight becomes a lethal force encounter. You need to use anything you can to survive--a knife, a gun, a stick, whatever. This is what I meant when I said "fighting is about survival".

[ QUOTE ]
But this does not abswer the question of just shooting them non lethaly. If I pull a gun and incapicitate someone with it, is this the same as using a baseball bat to do the same thing. If I do so have I won a fight?

[/ QUOTE ]

Pulling a gun out is a whole different ball game from a bat. Way worse for you in legal terms. Plus shooting someone is ridiculously lillegal, except for very few circumstances. You'd have to prove that your life was in imminent danger and the ONLY way to save yourself was to shoot the guy.

I doutb the jury will change their min din any way considering you went for a "non lethal" shot (which there are almost 0 in hte body, almost any gun shot wound is potentially fatal)

[imported_The Vibesman]

Having read the story and it's limited details, I'd have to say this is more on the "attack" than "fight" variety.

[ScottyP431]

I will say i believe most fights are not life threatening. Most fights erupt over things like drunkeness at bars or disagreements in pick up basketball games. Very few of these people die. Most people who get in fights are not hardend criminals. People who know each other are statistically more likely to fight than strangers. . When Friends/brothers get into fights there are rules of engagement. Ask anyone who comes from a family of 4 or more boys, no one is pulling a knife there. These norms spill over to society. Most people who get into fights are not lone psychotic individuals, they are people out with friends, and those friends put peer pressure on them to "defend their rep bro". These fights do not break out into arms races. Defending a woman who is being attacked from a rapist is clearly not what the OP was talking about when he said he wanted to go out and win a fight. You people need to stick to the subject. Most criminals i have met do not use weapons as they do not want to go back to jail. Do people break these rules sometimes? yes. Does that mean these kind of norms don't exist? no. R duke hit the nail on the head here. Most people dont want to kill /go to jail over the red socks or someone repeatedly charging them. They are sometimes willing to throw a few punches over it though. It is highly unlikely that when you fight John Q at a pickup basketball game that he will try and kill you with 40 odd other people around. You people are constructing exagerated hypothetical situations to justify your "id try and kill him cause he's trying to kill me " mentality. In fact i would say the exact opposite is true of your "middle class " argument. Most of the people who i know who have taken things to far/used weapons are upper class assholes who
1, have no experience with violence
2, believe they can get away with anything.
Your claim is obviously ill informed and most likely motivated by classism.
People who get in lots of fights know using a weapon will result in
1, uncontrolled escalation- once you pull a knife all bets are off, you could easily get shot/gang beat.
2, Retaliation- if you pull a knife on someone in an otherwise fair fight, odds go up astronomically that later on when you aren't expecting it there will be retaliation.
3, Jail- there is a huge differance in both liklihood to be prosecuted and ultimate jail time between assault and assault with a deadly weapon.

Most as you say "criminals" are not psychotic and are in fact pretty smart about fighting. This discussion i dont think is mainly about criminals, it's about the average population. I stand by my previous comment, if you start a fight with someone and then pull a weapon on them that is seriously f'ed up. If you are getting beat up and you pull a weapon because you are losing thats messed up as well. Arguably less so if you verbally submit and the other person does not stop, but still, you got into a fight, you should have considered the fact that you could lose beforehand.
In response to fight videos on the internet, shut up. Are you making a serious argument here? There are plenty of underground fighting rings that have rules, i also direct you to a movie called fight club... Seriously this point does nothing in this argument. This dude attacked someone. He did not have a "fight".

"their are rules to basketball, not to fights"

Please direct me to the official website for 1 on 1 street basketball rules. 90 percent of the fights i have seen have resulted from things like pick up sports games escalating.

[-Skeme-]

It wasn't even a fight. It was a setup. If the guy swung on him and then he maced him, sure, still pussy, but at least it was a real fight. He said the guy just came at him arguing.

[jaydub]

Wow, that must have taken some time to write out. Too bad it's completely [censored] drivel.

[ScottyP431]

Ha ha ha! Oh gosh that's funny! That's really funny! Do you write your own material? Do you? Because that is so fresh. You know, I've, I've never heard anyone make that joke before. Hmm. You're the first. And, and yet you've taken that and used it out of context to insult me in this everyday situation. God what a clever, smart girl you must be, to come up with a joke like that all by yourself. That's so fresh too. Any, any Titanic jokes you want to throw at me too as long as we're hitting these phenomena at the height of their popularity? God you're so funny!