WTF is so hard about 3/6?

[helpmeout]

Raising preflop gives you initiative, if no one connects with the flop you win.

Raising the weak end of raising hands also gives you more action on your bigger hands.

If people see you raising hands like AJo or 88, even worse hands in blind steal situations they arent going to put you on big pocket pairs or AK whenever you raise.

I played at a table yesterday and this weak/tight kept whining about how he couldnt make money on AA KK QQ. Its all he would raise, he wouldnt even raise AK. If an A hit the flop anyone could bet and this guy would fold KK QQ and then whine about it.

[Lawrence Ng]

[ QUOTE ]
Are you talking about the 5/10 SH or full?

[/ QUOTE ]

Either is pretty good, provided you are willing to find a a good game. I 4 to 6 table now, so preferably I don't like playing SH unless I want a seizure and permanent Carpel Tunnel Syndrome. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[Lawrence Ng]

[ QUOTE ]
Lawrence, if this is the case, why does'nt all the 2+2ers
jump to 5/10? Why do they grind it out at the much tougher
3/6 when they can jump up to the fishier 5/10?

[/ QUOTE ]

There are a number of reasons:

1. Bankroll deficiency.
2. Lack of Confidence to tackle a higher limit.
3. Many of the SS players on 2+2 have a rather large database built up on the 3-6 players. Some have well over 100k+ hands. This is extremely useful information and playing a different level, many 2+2 players would have to restart that database all over again. This takes time.
4. Some players do better in a tighter tougher game, as opposed to a looser fishier game. X2Ski is not one of them. He would more likely thrive in a looser fishier game.
5. Apart from the SH sub-forums, there's rarely any posting about how the 5-10 really is, so most 2+2ers are pretty uninformed about it.

Anyways, you don't have to take my word on it. My suggestion is to play a few thousand hands at that level, scope around for some good games and see for yourself. I'm merely parlaying my experience over.

Why? Simply put, there are a lot of bad players at that level. Some extra good (2+2 calibre) players to join that level won't hurt the game at all and would make for a nicer balance imo.

Lawrence

[Lawrence Ng]

[ QUOTE ]
If you are a winner at 2/4 you should be a winner at 3/6. So either you are running bad now, or you were just running good at 2/4. But whatever you do, DON'T jump to 5/10 because a few clueless people said its softer than 3/6.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was going to make a presentable argument, then I saw your loc saying you love Sponger. That explained everything.

[Lawrence Ng]

[ QUOTE ]
It sounds silly because it is. A player who cannot beat the party 3/6 is gonna get murdered at 5/10.

[/ QUOTE ]

If a player doesn't exercise game selection properly, he/she will get throttled at any level be it .5/$1 or $1000/$2000. The games are all relative in betting, it's the players that make a difference.

Some of the toughest games I played in were at the 4/8 level with a damn $3 rake. Some of the softest games I played in were at the 50/100 level with a $3 rake.

[gaming_mouse]

[ QUOTE ]

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: x2sk1 is in MP2 with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 <font color="purple">(x2sk1)</font> calls, <font color="CC3333">BobDibble raises</font>, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, MP2 <font color="purple">(x2sk1)</font> calls.

Flop: (5.33 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
x2sk1 checks, <font color="CC3333">BobDibble bets</font>, x2sk1 calls.

Turn: (3.66 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
x2sk1 checks, <font color="CC3333">BobDibble bets</font>, x2sk1 calls.

River: (5.66 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
x2sk1 checks, <font color="CC3333">BobDibble bets</font>, x2sk1 calls.

Final Pot: 7.66 BB


[/ QUOTE ]

What would the proper way to play this hand be? Give it on the flop? The turn?

TIA,
gm

[Shillx]

Against someone who has good raising standards, like a 2+2er, I would fold it on the flop.

Brad

[bobdibble]

Go over the range of hands that the PFR could have and I think that if you do the weighted average, you are drawing to around .5 outs. Yes, that is right, half an out. I'm not being sarcastic... You are mostly drawing dead or to a runner runner for a split pot.

Fold the flop.

[spamuell]

[ QUOTE ]

Go over the range of hands that the PFR could have and I think that if you do the weighted average, you are drawing to around .5 outs. Yes, that is right, half an out. I'm not being sarcastic... You are mostly drawing dead or to a runner runner for a split pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think you're raising enough from MP3 after one tight limper.

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
Hand 1:
Range of hands: AJo

Hand 2:
Range of hands: AA , KK , QQ , JJ , TT , 99 , 88 , AKs
AQs, AJs, ATs, A9s, A8s, KQs, KJs, KTs
K9s, QJs, QTs, AKo, AQo, AJo, ATo, KQo
KJo, KTo, QJo

Board: QdTcJs x x



Hand | 1 | 2 |
------+--------------+--------------+
Win | 365609 | 527863 |
Draw | 122268 | 122268 |
Lose | 527863 | 365609 |
------+--------------+--------------+
Win% | 42.01% | 57.99% |
------+--------------+--------------+ </pre><hr />

I realise you're out of position and your implied/reverse implied odds are not good. I'm just saying that you aren't drawing to half an out here. How did you get that?

Also, note you're getting like 6:1 on the flop, although your effective odds are considerably worse than that.

[gaming_mouse]

[ QUOTE ]

Range of hands: AA , KK , QQ , JJ , TT , 99 , 88 , AKs
AQs, AJs, ATs, A9s, A8s, KQs, KJs, KTs
K9s, QJs, QTs, AKo, AQo, AJo, ATo, KQo
KJo, KTo, QJo


[/ QUOTE ]

spamuell,

I like the analysis, but I think the range of hands you gave is too liberal. Unless you have a read on the PFR as a very loose raiser.

gm