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#41
09-07-2005, 01:50 AM
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Results
I was donk bluffing with K4 of clubs. I think the bluff is a pretty big mistake here as its just getting called way too often. It might be more viable if he had 1k more and I had 2k more. Or not. He had QJ.
Another interesting question is what range of hands should UTG bet the river and what should he check behind. 
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#42
09-07-2005, 02:41 AM
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Re: Results
wow, I suck. This excerise messed with me - this isn't how I would read it realtime. I think if we do this more, it will get easier to apply real time thinking. Cool excercise, we should do this again.
As for what should he bet and what should he check - I think two pair is the correct line. Though it does give you quite a decision if raised. Basically, the only hand that he beats if raised is a bluff. However, I like betting two pair, because you could easily have Ax and think it is good. You put himto a tough decision, and though you seem to beat yourself up on it, I think it is hard to call. However, this is online poker and people tend not to make the tough laydowns online. Here is my question for you, what do you raise here wihout it being a bluff? CSC
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#43
09-07-2005, 07:34 AM
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Re: Hand Reading, PP style
MLG has 88-22, AJs-A2s, KQs-K9s, QJs-98s, AQ. (small pocket played for set value, a suited ace, a possibly dominated big ace. I don't know that there's anything unsuited that he'd reasonably call here preflop. I guess the suited conns play like small pairs.)
UTG has AA-22, AKs-ATs, KQs-JTs, AK-AJ, KQ-KJ. Looks like UTG is trying to milk a set, which is a little dicey with a flush draw on the board, but hey, UTG minraised. I don't think UTG can call with one pair. The only reasonable set MLG could have is a set of fives, so any set UTG has is good. I think UTG has to call two pair here, normally. The Q only completes one straight, but barring the possibility MLG is bluffing the only hands that beat AJ are KT, AQ and 55, unless MLG did something really "creative" like smooth call AA against a field of 5. I think UTG calls aces up because the way he's played the hand, he looks weak and MLG might test him with a smaller two pair or a big ace. Obviously he calls with any set or the straight. AJ is very sad he didn't lead pot on flop. On to rest of thread, -D.
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#45
09-07-2005, 09:30 AM
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Re: Results
Nice exercise.
[ QUOTE ] Another interesting question is what range of hands should UTG bet the river and what should he check behind [/ QUOTE ] I think QJ was the smallest hand UTG could reasonably bet. It was entirely possible that you had A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]or A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] but UTG can't live in fear of one hand. The problem being if UTG gets raised, he has to fear a monster. [ QUOTE ] It might be more viable if he had 1k more and I had 2k more. [/ QUOTE ] I don't think UTG calls this in the 50/100 rnd, which I guess is what you might have been saying. The thing is, the minraise suggests such a lack of strategic sophistication that if you had a monster, you'd have stacked him, but there's no way you're going to fold him. That piece of info made me think you were betting into him with the nuts and that this was more of an academic exercise, "What hands does UTG call with so as to avoid exploitation after failing to define his hand?" In your case, however, you're counting on a minraiser to put you on a bigger hand than he has and get out of your way when he's had momentum the entire pot; I think that's unlikely. He almost certainly would have called with AKo. SHS '91, incidentally. -D.
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#47
09-07-2005, 09:57 AM
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Re: Results
Hmmm, we did the reads "double blind" so he could come to the conclusion that you are weak and view him as weak. You have him covered by quite a bit, so before he bets the river, I think he needs to know if he's going to call a reraise for the rest of his chips.
I think he needs top pair to bet the river. Personally I'd be checking QJ here, maybe I shouldn't be?
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#50
09-07-2005, 10:38 AM
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Re: Results
[ QUOTE ]
Here is my question for you, what do you raise here wihout it being a bluff? [/ QUOTE ] Probably K10 and A7 are the only two real hands I would ever cr here. I rarely cr the river in general. As for thinking its a bad move, you highlight why. I could easily have an A in this spot that i think is good, so its probably right for him to value bet lots of weird medium stength hands like JQ or whatever. That means that unlike in many situations his betting the river doesnt mean he has a really good hand or nothing. He can have a much larger range of value betting hands, many of which (especially from an unknown party player) will decide to call me without much thought. Its a good spot to cr the nuts, but a spot to cr bluff I think.
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