Slowplaying KK & JJ is bankroll suicide - Page 4

ThaHero · #31 02-11-2005, 08:35 PM

Ooops should have put .25/.50 lol

Well I gave it some thought and even in the Big Blinds it's probably best to fold this hand against a raise. I guess I learn something new everyday, because in the same situation I probably would have called.

emonrad87 · #32 02-11-2005, 08:43 PM

Its NL .25/.50 which = 25NL on party.

ThaHero · #33 02-11-2005, 08:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Its NL .25/.50 which = 25NL on party.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm new to this lingo. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] sorry...

elric · #34 02-11-2005, 09:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I have to agree with his play. He's playing .5/1 not $25NL. For a .50 BB and all he pays is another .50 to call, I'd just see the flop too. Now if someone reraises another $1 then I'd have to lay down but at .5/1 I don't see why this is a bad play.

[/ QUOTE ]

The game was $25 Max No Limit Hold Em on Party with $0.25-$0.50 Blinds. If I was playing limit I would be forced to fold pre-flop as the implied odds will never pay me off. Since it was No Limit I am 43:1 to flop a monster hand. When JJ called he made my call profitable(74 BB), without his call the play is unprofitable. Definitely a marginal play, most here think it is a terrible play. Although I believe it might help get some future action at the table having a 63o all-in image.

=====================

My odds to flop a monster are 43:1

.01% 4 of a kind
.09% Full House
.65% Straight
1.57% 3 of a kind
=======
2.32% (43:1)

My odds to flop two-pair are 33:1

3.03% (33:1)

Together I am at approx 18.5:1

5.35% (18.7:1)

PhatPots · #35 02-12-2005, 01:58 AM

I might have been worried about my kicker. The raise prf doesn't mean anything, it was just doubling the blinds. These were extremely passive players, strange hand.

Cheers,
Pots

pzhon · #36 02-12-2005, 03:40 AM

You may have a 5.35% chance to flop a "monster" hand, but you don't have a 5.35% chance to be ahead on the flop. You can make 2-pair while someone hits top set and you are almost dead, and you will lose a lot on those hands.

Even if you are ahead and all of the money goes in, the overpair often has many outs. In particular, if you flop 2-pair with 36o, your 2-pair can easily be counterfeited, e.g., if the third card on the flop pairs, or the turn and river are any pair.

You need much deeper stacks and a greater certainty of getting paid off to call a minraise with 36o against an overpair. If the flop had come A66, you could not expect to stack the player with JJ.

kyro · #37 02-12-2005, 05:05 AM

damn you, i was going to use that.

ripped · #38 02-17-2005, 09:29 AM

Few comments here.

First this hand was played terribly not by Elric but by the other 2 douchebags that didnt reraise preflop or make a bigger bet. You cant raise that small and hope that rags dont come in to see a flop. Now the worst play by far was not preflop but postflop. How the hell do 2 morons move in with a pair on board with that many callers and think they are best hand?

Quite frankly Elric made a good call to beat some very bad playing of high PP's. H was not going to fold the extra 50 cents in a $5 pot when he obviously already had half the bet already in the pot. It is a tough call but it costs him 50 cents to possibly make maybe $25+ (he made 60+) SO he made 120+ times the 50 cents calling this raise. Not a bad damn profit if you ask me. Yes it was a long shot to hit anything flop wise but the play is sooo bad at these limits that the morons with KK will call all ins and pay you off.

If so many people didnt limp in this pot it's a terrible call. With everyone in I believe it was the right call.

Seether · #39 02-17-2005, 12:56 PM

The only reason there are people defending his play is because he managed to get the best possible scenario for his hand. Would everyone be saying how much of a genius he was if one of them had TT or someone else had A6s?

He has a very raggy off suit two gapper and his out of position. Furthermore, his whole comment of "out playing" people on the flop is pretty rediculous with 50bb stacks. Unless by outplaying you simply mean outflopping.

HopeydaFish · #40 02-17-2005, 05:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]

The game was $25 Max No Limit Hold Em on Party with $0.25-$0.50 Blinds. If I was playing limit I would be forced to fold pre-flop as the implied odds will never pay me off. Since it was No Limit I am 43:1 to flop a monster hand. When JJ called he made my call profitable(74 BB), without his call the play is unprofitable. Definitely a marginal play, most here think it is a terrible play. Although I believe it might help get some future action at the table having a 63o all-in image.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess the better question is, what *wouldn't* you call with in this situation? Is 63o okay, but 72o a fish-move? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

It's one thing to protect your blinds, but folding *one* blind when you're holding crap like 63o won't affect your table image. If you feel your blinds are being stolen, make your stands with suited connectors, Ax, etc... Just because 63o paid off for you this time does not make those sorts of hands anywhere near +EV.

The original point was that it was moronic for your opponents to weakly raise what they did. They needed to play those hands stronger in order to chase out the fish holding 63o.