Sartre's Contradiction

[BZ_Zorro]

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For the most part philosophy is for people who are not smart enough to tackle tough questions that have indisputable answers. But unlike artists, linguists, etc they want to pretend otherwise. (Exceptions: Descarte, Leibniz, Russell.)

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I never thought I'd say this about one your posts, but...

POTD. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

[Zeno]

Strange that I had this marked from my reading to post on this forum. It is perhaps appropriate for this thread.

"Metaphysics is a refuge for men who have a strong desire to appear learned and profound but have nothing worth hearing to say. Their speculations have helped mankind hardly more than those of the astrologers. What we regard as good in metaphysics is really psychology: the rest is blah. Ordinarily, it does not even produce good phrases, but is dull and witless. The accumulated body of philosophical speculation is hopelessly self-contradictory. It is not a system at all, but simply a quarreling congeries of systems. The thing that makes philosophers respected is not actually their profundity, but simply their obscurity. They translate vague and dubious ideas into high-sounding words, and their dupes assume, as they assume themselves, that the resulting obfuscation is a contribution to knowledge."

–H.L. Mencken, from Minority Report

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[NotReady]

I'm happy yet shocked to find Mencken agrees with God on something:

18For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
19For it is written,
"I WILL DESTROY THE WISDOM OF THE WISE,
AND THE CLEVERNESS OF THE CLEVER I WILL SET ASIDE."
20Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?
21For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.


8See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ.


1And when I came to you, brethren, I did not come with superiority of speech or of wisdom, proclaiming to you the testimony of God.
2For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.
3I was with you in weakness and in fear and in much trembling,
4and my message and my preaching were not in persuasive words of wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power,
5so that your faith would not rest on the wisdom of men, but on the power of God.

20O Timothy, guard what has been entrusted to you, avoiding worldly and empty chatter and the opposing arguments of what is falsely called "knowledge"--
21which some have professed and thus gone astray from the faith

[Triumph36]

Sounds like Mencken had a bad time with Hegel.

Yet it's a sentiment that could only have serious strength after Hegel.

As for Sklansky's contention that philosophy is for those who cannot solve other problems, I find this to be far too 'modern' as well. The only 'indisputable' problems up until Newton were mathematical, and of an even more dubious nature than philosophy (excepting Archimedes).

It takes the entire body of philosophy as we know it to make the statements that Zeno and David made, yet there's something hopelessly utilitarian about both. The intelligent mind should seek out philosophy and then choose to dismiss it on its own. After all, when we're not dealing with indisputible things, we're left to come to our own conclusions.

[Zeno]

Mencken wrote, in part, to jolt, in addition to bringing his skeptical no nonsense approach to things. And he does a good job of it, but note that he mixes separate realms, as if metaphysics is the all of philosophical speculation. But such analysis detracts from the pleasure of reading such a great prose artist.

Cicero may have said it best: “There is nothing so absurd but some philosopher has said it.” I think that anyone who has waded through the bog of even a small bit of philosophical writings would have a hard time auguring against Cicero. But then he also said: “Philosophy is the best medicine for the mind.”

In the end, I often wonder if it is more profitable to go fly-fishing or bird watching than to try and muddle through some difficult text about why my existence is so meaningless, the why or why not of God’s existence, or how my knowledge about the external world is all wrong. So what? Beer still taste damn good after a long day of work doesn't it.

-Zeno

[pc in NM]

[ QUOTE ]
For the most part philosophy is for people who are not smart enough to tackle tough questions that have indisputable answers. But unlike artists, linguists, etc they want to pretend otherwise. (Exceptions: Descarte, Leibniz, Russell.)

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LOL

Careful, though, you're bordering on self-parody here....

[The once and future king]

[ QUOTE ]
For the most part philosophy is for people who are not smart enough to tackle tough questions that have indisputable answers. But unlike artists, linguists, etc they want to pretend otherwise. (Exceptions: Descarte, Leibniz, Russell.)

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This whole statement is rendered redundant by the fact that Science is a philosophy. Not surprising you made it as most people have a very feeble understanding of ontology and epistemology.

In laymens terms you are to ignorant about the subject matter to have an opinion that in anyway approaches validity.

Machines can be biult that pawn the average human being at math. You have a subjetive mind and that is what defines you as an entity. If you want to spend your life trying your best to get your subjectivity to resmeble an objective automated process or a pale shadow of my deskttop calculator go for it, well done you have just decided to utterly squander youre existenze. Might as well kill yourself now.

The mind that thinks>The mind that adds multiplies and subtracts.

[David Sklansky]

"Machines can be biult that pawn the average human being at math"

An amazingly ridiculous statement.

"If you want to spend your life trying your best to get your subjectivity to resmeble an objective automated process or a pale shadow of my deskttop calculator go for it, well done you have just decided to utterly squander youre existenze. Might as well kill yourself now."

Playing right into Not Ready's hands. Philosophy, to my knowledge, never discovers any ultimate truths anyway. It discusses questions that can't be answered (if there is no God). The reason you shouldn't kill yourself is the same reason a poodle shouldn't. (Assuming poodles go to strip clubs.)

[The Yugoslavian]

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The reason you shouldn't kill yourself is the same reason a poodle shouldn't. (Assuming poodles go to strip clubs.)

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This is perhaps the most profound insight in the whole thread.

Yugoslav
#1 scrippa stunna...

[David Sklansky]

I have totally changed my opinion of you.