Hypothetical question that will blow your mind.

My two cents: If you play like you know other players hands, you're going to trigger collusion detection systems. People are going to be less likely to detect "board foresight" because it's simply a much less likely form of cheating.

NL game = final board
limit game = everyone's hand PF.

[mudbuddha]

I'd have to disagree with you on that one. NL, your opponents cards are way more important the board. Hell, if you could see your opponents cards you could play blind. It would help to know your own cards of course. But if you only saw the board, you could not exploit every edge that you have.. suppose you have AK and you know the board is A2J2T are you going to fold preflop, just bc its a scary board on the river??

No, you're going to raise enough PF to get the "2"'s to fold. This is precisely my point.

In limit, I'd rather know what my opponents hold than see the flop before them. Because the betting is incremental, and a river bet isn't big in proportion to the size of the pot.

Also, imagine holding pocket 2's in LP (In a NL game) and knowing the final board is going to be AKQ22, you would have phenomenal power over this field. Hope this is more clear.

And in limit, it's better to know what your opponents hold. Say you have AK against a bunch of opponents. 1 has AQ, another has AQ, another has AQ, one has KQ, one has KJ, and another has KJ.

You know that no "Q" will flop, and no "K" will flop. This means that you really only have to worry about the "AQ" hands making a straight (needing 1 of the 2 remaining J's to fall). And, if one of the "J"s fall, than KJ takes the lead. Also, flushes would worry you a bit. But basically, you are a huge advantage to still have the best hand no matter what the flop is.

Knowing the flop here isn't going to help as much. Plus, you know that players will 3-bet and cap with all these AQ hands and stuff.

[SocialWelfareIV]

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Also, imagine holding pocket 2's in LP (In a NL game) and knowing the final board is going to be AKQ22, you would have phenomenal power over this field. Hope this is more clear.


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Holding 22 and knowing the final board will be AKQ22 of course puts you in great shape. Unfortunately, this will happen quite infrequently. You must consider not only the magnitude of the advantage you gain but also the frequency with which you can exploit this edge. If you can see your opponent's hole cards, you will never put a bet into the pot getting the worst of it unless you choose to do so (because your knowledge of your opponent's cards will allow you to make up the difference on later streets).

Knowing that you're going to flop a miracle full house or quads is great, but it just isn't going to happen enough in limit or no-limit to make it more advantageous than knowing your opponents cards.

Of course it does.

I'd much MUCH rather see the final board in a NL game. How is this not obvious? If you hold 22 and the final board is AJQ9A, you can fold PF no worries.

pocket 2's will make a set at least by the river far often enough for this to be a huge advantage. You don't need a "Miracle Quads" for this to be helpful.

OR... you hold TJ

You know the flop will be AKQ84.

Or you hold 36 and you know the flop will be AK245, imagine all the hands that pay you off. Knowing the whole community ahead of time is far more advantageous in NL.

The board - on the internet.
The players hands - B&M.
This decision is purely dictated by number of hands you can play at once. Playing hands that win most of the time or winning most of the time from every hand.

[Matt R.]

I can't believe so many people are voting that they'd rather see everyone else's hand. Think of all the money you would make in pots where you are BEHIND, yet you know for a fact that by the river you will win the (huge) pot.

I think the answer is obviously to know what the final board will be. You can play every single hand that you know will hit big... 72o, 32o, any 2 suited cards, as long as you know you'll make 2 pair or better by the river. You can STILL make your reads and figure out if your 2 pair is good, but there is no way you can ever know that your offsuit trash will turn into a full house by the river (if you choose to see everyone else's hand). Basically, you can still know in part what people are holding by their betting and/or their tells, but there is clearly no way to ever know what the final board will be. Knowing the final board is a way bigger advantage in my opinion.

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Think of all the money you would make in pots where you are BEHIND, yet you know for a fact that by the river you will win the (huge) pot.

I think the answer is obviously to know what the final board will be. You can play every single hand that you know will hit big... 72o, 32o, any 2 suited cards, as long as you know you'll make 2 pair or better by the river. You can STILL make your reads and figure out if your 2 pair is good, but there is no way you can ever know that your offsuit trash will turn into a full house by the river (if you choose to see everyone else's hand). Basically, you can still know in part what people are holding by their betting and/or their tells, but there is clearly no way to ever know what the final board will be. Knowing the final board is a way bigger advantage in my opinion.

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This is everything that I agree with. Like I said, if you hold 22 and you know the board will be AK522, and it's a NL cash game, you will guarantee to hit BIGTIME. Everyone says "Yeah but you hardly ever make quads". That's because you rarely stay in the hand past the flop to hit runner-runner quads on a board like this with 22.

And also, like this guy said, you can decipher a hand range of your opponent by the way you raise PF, and by how they play the hand. You can NEVER figure out what the board will be before seeing it. In other words you can't raise 6xbb and go "when you raise 6xbb the board will always pair". I mean come on. But when you raise 6xbb and you get a call, you can start to decipher what kind of hand villain holds ANYWAY!