Preflop, flop, turn, heck the whole thing up for debate...

[asofel]

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I'm going to try to be more like soldier.

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this is a good idea. let me know if i need to elaborate.

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this is too f'in funny [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

to add some thoughts though: I would also raise this. It helps define my hand, and depending on the action behind me it could help there as well. I think it makes the later streets easier to play as well.

Is it possible that this is an example where NL's line is right for his style of play where others line fits best for them? I think so often we get stuck into trying to figure out the most +EV line, and in some cases its really not provable or demonstrable. Maybe this isn't one of those cases, but I think its worthy of keeping in mind when discussing hands...

[Surfbullet]

Pf is okay.

I like waiting for the turn here. 6s, 7s, Ts, Js, Ks, As, [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]s can all be considered "Bad" cards which we may or may not want to raise. Once 3bet I'm concerned about A9/K9 or 89 rather than 9T or 79. It appears obvious from our action that the 9 improved us, so I'd just call figuring he doesn't care or it improved him as well.

Surf

[spydog]

I like your flop call. This is a great example of waiting until the turn to raise. Raising doesn't really help you play the rest of the hand because your opponents can't really put you on hand because you could be raising a pair/2pair/set/flush draw/straight draw/overcards + gutshot...etc. So, you won't really be able to interpret later action with much accuracy.

UTG's 3-bet on the turn is very strong. He knows he has zero fold equity, so his 3-bet is for value. I think 9x would have jumped at the opportunity to pop this flop, so I think he's got a boat here enough that I just call down.

I don't like the preflop call. It seems so clear to everyone that this call is good. Maybe I'm missing something?? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Blinds close the action and could raise while Q9o is going to the flop as a lock on being 4 or 5 handed. I can understand that domination isn't much of a factor here, but there are other reasons the hand doesn't play well multi-way.

A flop raise is better than a call considering half the deck will make the turn unraisable for you. Take the equity while it's there.

Love your turn raise, and the 3 bet doesn't scare me as much as it should....I would most likely cap.

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i doubt your equity is enough here to raise--i'd just call and pop a safe turn i think

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How good does hero's hand have to be have enough equity? A9? Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]9?

Asking to learn not to be a pain [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

[tansoku]

I'd fold pflop as these kinds of hands always seems to put me in marginal situations that spew chips, like as not.

I think the flop is a raise with TPGK and a couple morons in the hand, 'getting your money in with the best hand is never wrong' type argument.

7 outs to the nuts if you are behind, and the boat over boat implied odds are great. I can't see capping the turn improving your chances to win the hand, so it has to be for value.

Hands you are behind:
A9 = 4
K9 = 4
88 = 3
33 = 3
89? = 2
Hands you are ahead:

J9 = 4
T9 = 4

8/16 = 50%. Capping the turn is 1:1, and you improve to the nuts 15% of the time with 7 outs, 50+15 = 65%. Looks like a raise, even if you include 89 here and discount your outs a bit..

It gets more complex if you assume A8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]/ [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] can play this way as he can now improve when you don't..

Hopefully I didn't botch this too badly. Cap the turn, call a river bet UI looks like the line.

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Hands you are behind:
A9 = 4
K9 = 4
88 = 3
33 = 3
89? = 2
Hands you are ahead:

J9 = 4
T9 = 4

8/16 = 50%. Capping the turn is 1:1, and you improve to the nuts 15% of the time with 7 outs, 50+15 = 65%. Looks like a raise, even if you include 89 here and discount your outs a bit..

It gets more complex if you assume A8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]/ [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] can play this way as he can now improve when you don't.

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Unfortunately, this is far from the truth.

Considering UTG is a fish and just came to life on a turn 3-bet, it should read more like:

Hands you are behind:
88 = 3
33 = 3

Hands you are ahead:
Anything that this loose fish decides to raise on impulse (including, but not limited to a draw that Hero is making costly for him - where he says, "I won't stand for this sh!t; I'm gonna raise").

[rory]

Preflop is good.

I just call on the flop-- there are many cards you don't like on the turn and if the SB decides to bet again, he gets to find out if you are beat with your Q9 by getting popped, so it costs you nothing. Your equity in the hand is not so great on the flop and if you raise the flop, you set up a situation where you lose your good position on the turn. The most likely turn situation if you raise the flop is it gets checked to you and you bet. And then if you are beat you get to get check-raised and all of that fun stuff. If you just call on the flop, then the most likely turn situation is there is the SB bets again and everyone else reacts to the bet before you and then you decide what to do.

On the turn, you are behind to a boat a lot. I would just call the turn and also call the river unimproved, in case this guy is playing a worse 9 weird or tried to get fancy with an overpair or something. I dunno, you called him bad-- dunno what that means but I'm going to showdown with this hand. I don't even really consider capping the turn if that was on your mind.

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Preflop is good.


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Others have said this too, but I just can't find anything but a fold. Could you please explain your logic for the call?

[krishanleong]

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Preflop is good.


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Others have said this too, but I just can't find anything but a fold. Could you please explain your logic for the call?

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Would you call QTo?

Krishan