Pay Attention or Just Pay (how to develop your reads)

[grjr]

I just wanted to add that if you're playing on Party you can get Pokerace and it will automatically flash the other players' showdown cards. This will give you 10 spare seconds a hand to surf some porn.

[droolie]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is a really good post. Not in the "I skimmed over your post and it's long and you're a pooh-bah so I'll go with the group and say it's good" sense, but in the "this is very well articulated poker advice" sense.



[/ QUOTE ]

IIRC, droolie is one of those old dudes. I think he already has kids.

If so,

<-----

[/ QUOTE ]

I've actually always kind of pictured him looking like the Fred Savage from his old avatar (in his defense, the older one). FYI: I'm picturing that you look like Huey Lewis now.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm much funnier in real life...

[Redd]

[ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]

FYP. And the sweet, sweet irony is that I did this while playing poker, costing myself valuable reads.

Seriously, this is a good post. I'll derail this very useful thread no longer.

[shadow29]

[ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]

[DavidC]

Porn and poker don't work well together for me...

... maybe if I had a left-handed mouse or something.

[PokerSparky]

Ahh, the beauty of being ambidextrous.

[DavidC]

Awesome post.

I'm going to add some comments.

--------

[ QUOTE ]
we would like for our edge to be as large as possible to account for random chance (variance).

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh... I'm not sure that this follows. We have bankrolls to account for variance, and we want our edge to be as large as possible, because it's better to make $10 than to make $5. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
What they both have in common is that they will repeat similar actions when placed in a similar situation in the future.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is particularly relevant to the limits that we play, and particularly relevant to limit holdem, as opposed to no-limit, where even the fish mix it up a bit as the limits get higher...

It should also be noted that players with similar PT stats tend to behave in similar ways. This isn't ironclad, as VPIP 16 can mean hugely different things for two different opponents, but they have more in common with eachother than with a guy with vpip 9 or 60.

In LHE, sometimes a play is such a clear winner that a master can no afford to deviate from it. Example: 7 way 3-bet pot, master has AA, no matter what pattern he currently has going, he's capping it! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

KQo UTG might be a good thing to randomize a bit: between raising and calling, since they run so close in value. Other things like that...
Pokerace is a nifty program similar to GT+/PV that displays cards as they're being shown down.

[ QUOTE ]
Develop (hand reading) now or pay for it dearly (in tougher games).

[/ QUOTE ]

An alternative, weak as it seems, and there's no way I advocate it, is just to avoid playing in these games. Since they are profitable, challenging and fun, though, I think picking up the skills you talk about is probably the best way to go. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

One thing that I've found is that if, while playing four tables, I set a goal of "one read per 3-minutes", I get a lot of work done. Alternatively, sometimes instead of making my sessions 60 minutes long or whatever, i"ll make it 20 reads long instead.

I keep this track of this on a sheet of paper when I'm going it.

The problem is, I find myself writing out the action in a hand, rather than general stuff like "will dbt with oesd", and as such, those notes aren't as helpful for future sessions as they are for the current session when it's fresh in your mind.

I will point out, though, that it FEELS GREAT to sit at a table at party and see a note on every single player. Really, really great.

---

And sure, bump... sometimes friggin LPP's will bluff checkraise the river if they're tilting a bit (donkbetting bluff seems to be more common, but I'm not sure).

[DavidC]

[ QUOTE ]
I read about a third of your post...then went back to surfing porn [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

(reference from rathergood.com)

Porn and poker go together like strawberries and cream.

Nice one.

I agree that the more tables you play, the more generic your play becomes and the less you can take advantage of specific situations - mainly because you don't spot them. PT stats although useful don't tell the full story. Some players will play XXs from any position, others Ax. If as OP said, you play a single table and actually concentrate you pick up way more information. Although you can go back and review hands later, it may be too late because you may not see some of those players again and other circumstances will have changed.

I suppose we all have to ask ourselves why we play. If it is to make the most money in the shortest time then 8 tables at 1BB/100 is better than 1 table at 4BB/100 and who cares if it's not 100% optimum poker. However, it must be true that a good player will make less than he would otherwise have done at a table as more tables are added to divide his attention.

2-3BB is generally cited as a sustainable long term winrate. I suspect that many 2+2'ers could do better than this online if they stuck to a single table. Out of interest how about posting some winrates and the number of tables you usually play?

[jrz1972]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is a really good post. Not in the "I skimmed over your post and it's long and you're a pooh-bah so I'll go with the group and say it's good" sense, but in the "this is very well articulated poker advice" sense.



[/ QUOTE ]

IIRC, droolie is one of those old dudes. I think he already has kids.

If so,

<-----

[/ QUOTE ]

I've actually always kind of pictured him looking like the Fred Savage from his old avatar (in his defense, the older one). FYI: I'm picturing that you look like Huey Lewis now.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm much funnier in real life...



[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, flying kites near power lines is -EV.

Do you see why?