67s, great flop but 2 bets to you? - Page 3

MATT111 · #21 08-10-2005, 09:13 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Easy raise?

[/ QUOTE ]

I`m not sure. The pot contains 9SB so far. Do we want to build the pot or protect our hand?
If we want to build the pot is it better to raise or to go for overcalls?

#22 08-10-2005, 09:25 AM

Im raising here, I dont like the call at all, your up against a LAG who could hold a huge variety of hands, your outs are enormus, you have a sf draw, a fd, a str8 draw(chop), and a boat draw, your gaining equity on your bets here. If this guys was a great player I might slow down. I dont think anyone is on a higher flush draw, and if thats the case, thats a beat your going to have to accept. It would suck hard to just call and have someone overcall for cheap with a larger str8 draw, or even a lower 2 pr draw! We may even be the best hand here, but im raising to make people pay to draw out, which certainly some are trying to do

cant wait to see what happened
cdl

smokylosecannon · #23 08-10-2005, 11:28 AM

here is result. board makes stright on end. i don't know why two other players fold, but board plays and the pot was split between two of us.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 8 handed) http://216.119.70.224/converter/hhconverter.pl

Preflop: Hero is CO with 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 raises, MP2 folds, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

River: (17 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 21 BB

Rev. Good Will · #24 08-10-2005, 11:33 AM

[ QUOTE ]
here is result. board makes stright on end. i don't know why two other players fold, but board plays and the pot was split between two of us.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 8 handed) http://216.119.70.224/converter/hhconverter.pl

Preflop: Hero is CO with 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 raises, MP2 folds, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

River: (17 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 21 BB

[/ QUOTE ]

that was a very ballsy (reckless almost) move on the river.

Aaron W. · #25 08-10-2005, 12:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
here is result. board makes stright on end. i don't know why two other players fold, but board plays and the pot was split between two of us.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 8 handed) http://216.119.70.224/converter/hhconverter.pl

Preflop: Hero is CO with 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 raises, MP2 folds, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

River: (17 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 21 BB

[/ QUOTE ]

that was a very ballsy (reckless almost) move on the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes it is. But I like it. The pot is huge and your position is right. You will very rarely lose 3 BB to a 9 based on the action, and you win about 2 BB when one guy folds and 5 BB when two fold. Plus you get some bonus tilt out of the guys who do fold.

cfjr2 · #26 08-10-2005, 12:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
here is result. board makes stright on end. i don't know why two other players fold, but board plays and the pot was split between two of us.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 8 handed) http://216.119.70.224/converter/hhconverter.pl

Preflop: Hero is CO with 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 raises, MP2 folds, Hero 3-bets, SB folds, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

River: (17 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 21 BB

[/ QUOTE ]

that was a very ballsy (reckless almost) move on the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh that is too good - nice way to pick up some extra bets. Hope MP1 thanked you [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

bottomset · #27 08-10-2005, 06:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I still disagree with raising here. Our equity is approximately 30% at this point, assuming we are behind a straight. Our equity isn't enough to raise unless we get all 4 players to call.

We might still be ahead, granted, but I believe that trying to get a weak pair to overcall behind us praying for a chop is fantastic here since the draw doens't come in the majority of the time, and we might score another BB from him if MP1 bluffs the river again and the pair overcalls, and possibly Button with raise it for us on the turn, trapping the field.

Also, I think that we lose more when we are behind but win the same when we are ahead if we raise.

The thoughts are kinda [censored] up, since I'm tired as hell right now, but hopefully something meaningful is there.

I'm not convinced raising is right.

[/ QUOTE ]

look at how the action went on the flop

BB lead out, so its usually a pair or a 6 or a FD
its doubtful he has an 8 or 3..and neither of those hands is likely leading the flop .. maybe he has something like a pair+gutshot but again I don't think thats too likely

UTG limped in with anyhand with a 8 or 3 in it besides A3, and A8 and Lags well have their own standards

the turn 6 is usually a great card for you, since it makes your hand better than all flopped 2pairhands, and is unlikely to give put a straight out there

I'd say you are ahead 1/3 to 1/2 the time maybe even a little more .. plus you have a monsterdraw .. you would like to fold anyone with a 9, and if they call often they are putting in 2bets hoping for a chop, and 2of the chop outs give you the nuts

baronzeus · #28 08-10-2005, 06:52 PM

Your hand is significantly worse on the turn than it was on the flop. Your equity dropped from 70% to 30% or so.

Kumubou · #29 08-10-2005, 06:58 PM

You really think Hero's odds of being best right here right now is zero percent?

With only a LAG betting into him?

I call boshit.

-K

bottomset · #30 08-10-2005, 07:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Your hand is significantly worse on the turn than it was on the flop. Your equity dropped from 70% to 30% or so.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe 70 to 50ish, but no way in hell are you always behind here