I like this...PVS on Lvl. 4 when well equipped.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It's good to have some basic rules, but you really need to know what to do in exact situations to really do well

[/ QUOTE ]

You want to know how to play in an exact level 4 situation. Play like this:

NL Hold'em $50 Buy-in + $5 Entry Fee Trny:11949528 Level:4 Blinds(50/100) - Thursday, May 05, 21:59:10 EDT 2005
Table Table 11739 (Real Money)
Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 7
Seat 2: shaft48 ( $2295 )
Seat 3: The_Program ( $1710 )
Seat 4: kidneb2 ( $1775 )
Seat 5: philvansexton ( $615 )
Seat 8: SueBCatcher ( $1705 )
Seat 9: bocce ( $1345 )
Seat 10: setsofclubs ( $555 )
Trny:11949528 Level:4
Blinds(50/100)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to philvansexton [ 8h 6d ]
shaft48 folds.
The_Program folds.
kidneb2 folds.
philvansexton is all-In [615]
SueBCatcher calls [615].
bocce is all-In [1295]
setsofclubs folds.
>You have options at Table 14533 Table!.
SueBCatcher calls [730].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 8c, 5c, 6h ]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 9d ]
** Dealing River ** [ 3d ]
bocce shows [ Ac, As ] a pair of aces.
philvansexton shows [ 8h, 6d ] two pairs, eights and sixes.
SueBCatcher shows [ Ah, Kd ] high card ace.
bocce wins 1460 chips from side pot #1 with a pair of aces.
philvansexton wins 1945 chips from the main pot with two pairs, eights and sixes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow. Were you screwing around? Because from where I'm standing your all-in looks horrible.

[curtains]

The allin isnt terrible. Against normal calling ranges it's probably +EV. (Although I'd fold here quite often, but that's another story)

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]
The allin isnt terrible. Against normal calling ranges it's probably +EV. (Although I'd fold here quite often, but that's another story)

[/ QUOTE ]

I gotta disagree, I think it's just plain terrible. Maybe there's a LOT more FE at the $55s than I realized, as compared to the $22s/$33s. At the $22s/$33s, I don't even think it's a good push from the button.

[curtains]

It's definitely not plain terrible. Don't make me run it man!!! I'm too lazy to put in the numbers. Note that I usually don't make this play anyway.

[ilya]

[ QUOTE ]

It's definitely not plain terrible. Don't make me run it man!!! I'm too lazy to put in the numbers. Note that I usually don't make this play anyway.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, I'll run them myself. I'm gonna be real surprised if it turns out not to be terrible.

[curtains]

Ok I freaking ran it. Against a range like (22+,A2s+,A3o+,KTs+,KJo+,QJs). It's actually slightly +EV to push here. Note that this range is actually quite loose, as most people will fold quite a few of the above hands from the blinds, especially in the 55s. Against this range its practically breakeven, with a .1% advantage towards pushing...however if you tighten it up just a bit, it becomes more seriously +EV.

This range (44+,A7s+,A9o+,KJs+), makes it +.6% EV, which is pretty signifigant. One thing that eastbay's program has helped me with, is that I seem to intuitively know whether a push will be EV or not without even having to enter it anymore.

[The Yugoslavian]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

It's definitely not plain terrible. Don't make me run it man!!! I'm too lazy to put in the numbers. Note that I usually don't make this play anyway.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, I'll run them myself. I'm gonna be real surprised if it turns out not to be terrible.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're gonna be surprised.

Yugoslav

[AA suited]

phil

isnt it too risky to steal as CO when there are 7 players left? (you have plenty of time to catch cards before blinds come back to you, no?)

if so, then what's the reasoning for pushing with 86o as CO?

[curtains]

His reasoning is that the blinds will fold a large % of the time, and those rare times that they don't he will get lucky and suck out on both of them sometimes, with all of this adding up to a +EV play for him, in his opinion.

[AA suited]

[ QUOTE ]

Ok I freaking ran it. Against a range like (22+,A2s+,A3o+,KTs+,KJo+,QJs). It's actually slightly +EV to push here. Note that this range is actually quite loose, as most people will fold quite a few of the above hands from the blinds, especially in the 55s. Against this range its practically breakeven, with a .1% advantage towards pushing...however if you tighten it up just a bit, it becomes more seriously +EV.

This range (44+,A7s+,A9o+,KJs+), makes it +.6% EV, which is pretty signifigant. One thing that eastbay's program has helped me with, is that I seem to intuitively know whether a push will be EV or not without even having to enter it anymore.

[/ QUOTE ]

curtains,

i get the opposite.

vs a call range of (22+,A2s+,A3o+,KTs+,KJo+,QJs), 86o is -EV.

vs a tighter call range of (44+,A7s+,A9o+,KJs+), it is slightly +EV by .2%.