Paradise 25$ NL hand

[TheWorstPlayer]

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For the all-in. I was raising 19$ (5$call + 14$ raise) to win a 50$ pot (6$preflop +3$my bet + 8$his bet + 19$mine + 14$ his call)=50$.


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You can't include your own $19 in the pot size. If you fold now, you end up with $19. If you push and win, you end up with $50. So you are risking $19 to make $31.

[TheWorstPlayer]

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Worst, for the hand in question, the push after the reraise is a no brainer in my opinion. After a player commits half of his stack, your folding equity rapidily approaches zero.

So lets go back to the start of the round. I am first to act with 6 players in the hand, and a nice pot 6$. You mention getting all in, would you lead out? Check raise? What about if you believed there was post flop folding equity (at this table, there absolutely was)? With F.E. I think trying to get heads up against TP is the best situation if you can get it. I think you definitely get paid off on your straight, and I disagree that you cant check a made flush to induce a bluff on the turn, especially if the pot isn't overly large. There are 16 scare cards (6 make higher flush, 10 make full house), and he isnt drawing all of them. So if you think there is a 50/50 chance they will make a pot sized bet (they wont think they are bluffing with TP) you win. Thoughts?


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Read Soah's post above. Let's even acknowledge that you are a favorite on the flop. Still, if the turn and river are blanks, you lose the hand. So, if opponent would do exactly what you want, then you should just check/call the flop, check/call the turn if it blanks, and check/fold the river if it blanks. If at any point you hit, you should push and have the other guy call. That is the way to make the most, when you are controlling both people. My suggestion is that this may actually be the scenario here. There is no point in making fancy flop pushes when the guy is going to pay you off even AFTER you hit. Just try to see if you hit as cheaply as possible and then worry about getting the money in. It usually isn't hard to do.

[A_PLUS]

Your right, dumb mistake.
Thanks

So It is actually an incorrect (FTOP sense) play only if the opponent holds the Jack of clubs and another club.

[TheWorstPlayer]

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So It is actually an incorrect (FTOP sense) play only if the opponent holds the Jack of clubs and another club.

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This sounds correct, but I can't guarantee it now since I haven't worked it out. I think the key, though, is trying to make your opponent make as big a mistake as possible. If you draw hits and he is drawing dead, you can make him make a HUGE mistake if he will still pay you off.

[numb3rs]

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Maybe it is table selection. I do data mine for at least 30 hands before I sit and won't sit at a table without at least 2 people seeing over 60% of flops. I also like to have at least one person raising 30% preflop. The more maniacs the merrier.

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I find this interesting how you assess table conditions. Do you have a feel for ranges that these stats should be in? What should a good player's VPIP% and PFR% be for 6 handed NL?

Last night I was at a table with an unbeatable player with a VPIP% of over 75; his PFR% was less than 2 however; he managed to get up over $215 at the 6 max $25 NL table. It was a good table in terms of loose players, but it was missing the loose aggressives as you describe.

[TheWorstPlayer]

I have heard it said that you can beat SS 6 Max consistently with a VPIP up to around 60%. That can only be done, however, if you can play very well post flop. I cannot do that. I beat SS 6 max consistently with a VPIP around 20% which I think is in line with most TAGs around here. I have a PFR% of around 10% which I think may be a bit higher than most people's but is probably in the same ballpark. I have also seen people beating games with ridiculous numbers. I do not think that is sustainable unless they are very good players and if they are, they might as well be playing higher limits. The people I have seen have been getting lucky against other big stacks. Yesterday I saw a guy with 4x the buy-in at a 100BB site, full ring who was incredibly LAG (75/50). I sat down and decided it was juicy pickings. I played three big hands with him losing them all to a 2 outer and 2 4-outers. These things just happen. That guy will not have a high win rate if he plays 100K hands, I promise.

[amoeba]

I have tried the LAG approach but it has not worked too well for me. I think I have to start out TAG when I sit down at a table then gradually move to LAG.

what I hate is losing money to a fish and then have somebody else at the table cleaning him out.

[ryanghall]

This is an easy preflop fold.

Since you got about as good a flop as you can hope for, I don't think there can be any argument that you certainly come over the top of his raise and put all your chips in the middle.

Ryan

[A_PLUS]

Thanks everyone, especially worst.

I agree that the best move would have been to call the 5$ raise and wait to see the turn. What is your thoughts about play on the turn? There will now be 22$ in the pot, and with his stack at 14$, I will be getting correct odds to call any of his bets. But, here is the catch. My EV, although always positive, decreases as the amount he bets increases. If he were to chekc the turn, I have an EV of 7+$. If he pushes, my EV drops to $2.3. So now lets add some folding equity. If he will fold 10% of the time to my all in bet, the only time this is a bad play is when he was going to let me see the river for less than 7$. I think lead out and push if an overcard to the jack falls, being that F.E. would be at its highest then. Or possibly lead out for 4-5$ being that many weak players will get in a protective call station mode when someone plays back at their TPTK. thoughts?

[TheWorstPlayer]

I think it really depends on the player. Against an aggressive player (like myself) I might check/call turn, check/raise river. A daring and VERY effective play against a decent, but not good, opponent (like myself). If you miss the turn, I would just check/call or maybe check/raise all-in if an over hits. Probably check/call. Either he will be building a pot for me, or he will give me a free card. Honestly, I would not be surprised to see him give you a free card here. People often get scared when their raises get called.