Terrible call on the turn? and question about pot odds

[Blake Lovely]

I agree with putting in some bets on the flop here. It is +ev to check raise and pump this pot on the flop.

Maybe as general advice for a new player you should just always call down with a 4 flush, but in this instance, I dont believe its correct to call on the turn.

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
but in this instance, I dont believe its correct to call on the turn.


[/ QUOTE ]

Based on what? There are no reads given on the opponents in this hand. Not that that would matter, i'm still calling this turn.

You are dead wrong. You call in this spot, period. All 3 opponents are jamming here, likely without a draw. There is no real indication that if you hit your flush it won't be good. Folding here is horrendous and extremely weak, seeing monsters way of thinking. Your stomach couldn't hold enough bile that you'd expectorate should your flush come in, you folded the turn, and it would've been good in this huge a pot. What the hell is everyone afraid of here!?!

b

[Blake Lovely]

Too many if's to make the call correct.
You cant factor in the fact that you'll be sad if it hits.

You are currently getting 3-1 on a 5-1 shot that you can most likely only give 7 outs too making it 7-1.
Maybe 8 outs making it 6-1 but I think 7 is right.
It looks like the whole table just woke up on the turn. Generally a bet, raise and reraise in front of you means somebody connected with the board.
So, you are calling against the odds, that is clear.
You are hoping to make up the bets on the river (implied odds).
I dont think with this flush draw you are picking up many bets when you are good (people like to shut down when the obvioius draw gets there and they dont beat it), and you will probly put in a couple more bets if someone has the higher flush.

So if everything happens perfectly yes you will show a slight profit.
But there is no way the call is that clear.

[MicroBob]

Folding here is a bad idea.

your statement that there is a 'good chance' that you will get beaten by a higher flush-draw is incorrect.
unless you're holding the nuts there is ALWAYS a chance someone else will be better.
But i don't know how you can say there is a 'good chance' in this situation.

There is no reason to think your flush-draw wouldn't be good. Even if you think there is a 10% chance that someone could have a higher flush (which I think would be pushing it) you should still be calling here.

folding here is -EV....calling to try to hit the flush is +EV.
It's as simple as that.

[elindauer]

Hi Blake,

I think you may be overlooking the gutshot straight draw here. I agree that drawing to just the mediocre flush draw in this pot is wrong. The gutshot makes it close though.

good luck.
eric

[Blake Lovely]

ah ok, your right I diddnt even notice it.
Yea that adds 3 outs. pushing you to 4-1 dog.
That makes it a good call. Still fairly close, but a call none the less.
I agree now thanks elin.

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree that drawing to just the mediocre flush draw in this pot is wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't agree. This is an easy call.

b

[bernie]

[ QUOTE ]
Too many if's to make the call correct.

[/ QUOTE ]

Way too scared of thinking.

[ QUOTE ]
You are currently getting 3-1 on a 5-1 shot that you can most likely only give 7 outs too making it 7-1.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually 7 outs is about 5.5-1. Your also not really counting the money in the pot already, plus some implied odds.

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe 8 outs making it 6-1 but I think 7 is right

[/ QUOTE ]

8 outs is better than 5-1.

[ QUOTE ]
It looks like the whole table just woke up on the turn. Generally a bet, raise and reraise in front of you means somebody connected with the board.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which can indicate that your drawing very live if the flush hits. The main thing i'd look out for is if the board paired.

It's also bad to fold here given the table and opponent description. Which is 'none'.

b

[MicroBob]

I agree with Bernie that I don't agree.

The call should be routine on just the flush-draw alone.

[Mizzles]

BB shows [ Td, 5d ] high card ace.
UTG shows [ Ad, 6d ] a pair of aces.
UTG + 1 shows [ 2h, 3c ] two pairs, threes and twos.
CO shows [ As, 7h ] two pairs, aces and sevens.
CO wins $607 from the main pot with two pairs, aces and sevens.