I love it when a plan comes together

[sublime]

Without a PFR, doesn't this change things a bit, though? everyone has shown weakness by limping in, unless someone failed a LRR attempt -- which is unlikely. Isn't betting and having someone raise, unfortunately thinning the field, still better than checking and having it checked through?

How often do you see this being checked thru? Not often I imagine, so you are still getting value on somebody elses bet.

By checking and seeing WHERE a bet comes from, you have now given yourself options, where before you were just going by what felt right.

As you move up in limits the level of agression (not really skill as much) will increase and a play like this becomes more important.

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
Without a PFR, doesn't this change things a bit, though? everyone has shown weakness by limping in, unless someone failed a LRR attempt -- which is unlikely. Isn't betting and having someone raise, unfortunately thinning the field, still better than checking and having it checked through?

How often do you see this being checked thru? Not often I imagine, so you are still getting value on somebody elses bet.

By checking and seeing WHERE a bet comes from, you have now given yourself options, where before you were just going by what felt right.

As you move up in limits the level of agression (not really skill as much) will increase and a play like this becomes more important.

[/ QUOTE ]
I see exactly what you mean about aggression. 1/2 is INCREDIBLY passive, and you really have to bet your draws, because I see a lot of situations where other people won't bet them for me.

Any idea where this shift starts to happen? 1/2 6max definitely has the aggression where I could check this to get information; what about 2/4? When should I start to consider the benefits of checking on flops like this?

How does this change if the flop is A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]?

Rob

[sublime]

I see exactly what you mean about aggression. 1/2 is INCREDIBLY passive, and you really have to bet your draws, because I see a lot of situations where other people won't bet them for me.

This flop will get bet at 1/2. If not by somebody with an ace, at least a LP player with a king.

Consider them now (I am not sure about 6max I never played it) I mean you have four opponents on a AK high flop. It will get bet the LARGE majority of the time. When it gets bet by somebody in EP, your c/r for value will more than make up for the very rare times it was checked thru.

I started playing baby draws on flops like this at 3/6. I havent played 2/4 or 1/2 in a while [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
When it gets bet by somebody in EP, your c/r for value will more than make up for the very rare times it was checked thru.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point.

Damn, just when I start to think I've figured out this game, I realize I've got a lot to learn.

It's nice to know that just because you're aggressive doesn't mean you need to bet out on all your draws. I'm assuming this changes when the flop is something like 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], right?

Rob

[sublime]

It's nice to know that just because you're aggressive doesn't mean you need to bet out on all your draws. I'm assuming this changes when the flop is something like 2 9 4 , right?

Of course. Not only might it not be bet(or raised), but you can sometimes drag the pot right then.

[SoaringAngle]

OK, whew, that makes me feel better
Im just glad i posted about that or I would still be confused