Takin a Shot at 25/50, KK play

[arod15]

Bet more on the flop more on the turn. Dont check the turn bad spot to check....

[amoeba]

a 3/4 pot bet on the turn is 1800. if villain calls, pot on river is around 6000.

how much are you willing to call on the river?


3/4 pot bet on the turn is bad bad bad.

[amoeba]

I agree with this line. The op's line wasn't bad but I like calling the flop and calling the turn if he bets, betting the turn if he checks.

the only problem with smoothcalling the flop is if heart hits the turn and villain bets in to you with a bluff and forces you to fold but I find this a very rare situation.

[luckOverSkill]

>a 3/4 pot bet on the turn is 1800. if villain calls, pot
>on river is around 6000.
>
>how much are you willing to call on the river?
>
>3/4 pot bet on the turn is bad bad bad.


Dunno man. The point of a sizeable turn bet is to
represent enough strength on your part to force him
to hope for a free showdown on the river if he
calls (he could easily have an overpair smaller
than KK with the call he made on the flop).

Of course he also may decide that he's seen enough and
actually fold to your turn bet. If he calls the turn
and then wakes up with a bet on the river, then you're
probably beat, especially since you've had the betting
lead up to this point. I'd muck and wouldn't too
feel too badly about it. That's poker.

One thing for sure - I'd rather bet on the turn
than have to call on the river...

[amoeba]

why do you hope for a free showdown when you've already put in a majority of your money in on the turn?

if he calls and he leads the river for 1/3 pot? you going to fold? he leads for 1/4 pot?

you only save 600 here with a 3/4 turn bet assuming with a better hand, he'll do something that makes it transparent that its correct to fold and that he won't bluff with a weaker hand.

your bet on the turn is typical of a bet that gets a weaker hand to fold and a stronger hand to call. maybe you get a smaller overpair to call but I would rather check behind and let smaller overpair feel safe and river bet.

Unless if you think villain is capable of pushing on a gross overbet on the river, turn check is better.

[creedofhubris]

I like this line against a tricky opponent.

Preflop raise.

Steal bet, raise, call.

So he's got something, or he's interested in resteal possibilities.

Check/check, this is either weakness or extreme strength from you.

But you've now encouraged a whifffed draw or possibly even a mid-pair to come out firing. So here he goes, boom, on the river.

Of course, if he has a set he'd play it the same way, but I like your line a lot.

[n1bd]

[ QUOTE ]
One thing for sure - I'd rather bet on the turn
than have to call on the river...

[/ QUOTE ]
What if I told you your opponent will fire a pot-sized river bluff 100% of the time when he misses? Even if you accidentally pay off a pot-sized river bet 100% of the time when he hits, it should be easy to see that checking the turn is more profitable in this case than blowing him off a worse hand with a big turn bet. There are no rewards in poker for "finding out where you're at," only for winning the most money overall and for winning well-publicized tourneys.

[JMP300z]

Pretty standard i thinks...I like the check on the turn....lots of draws missed and you dont want to be check raised here...The problem is the pots gotten decent sized and so long as no scary cards come or some epiphany like read...more money's going in. The best way to get the money in w/ this hand is to have the opponent willing to put it in with a wider range of hands than just stuff that beats you. Thus, check behind, induce bluffs and judge the opponents actions on the river.

Also allows you to take free cards when you semibluff raise the flop more often.

-JP

[cero_z]

Hi padirk165,

[ QUOTE ]
Cero, just wonderig Why you and everyone else is saying that they like the turn check?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because you have to fold if he check-raises, and checking behind him encourages him to bluff on the river. I expect to have to call one more sizeable bet in this hand, and I might as well increase the chance that I'm calling a bluff, since I'm going to look at a better hand some significant portion of the time.

I think people who are recommending a turn bet/fold to a raise are out of tune with how often you'll be bluff-check-raised here, and how big a disaster it is when you are and fold.

[AZK]

well said

So results?