Small Pairs in BB

[Dr. StrangeloveX]

I can just see peter griffin getting a sly look on his face. "I like where you're going with this...Tell me more."

[Rotating Rabbit]

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Simple math. Most hands miss most flops. And when most hands hit the flop, they hit it weakly.

This sounds profitable to me.

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This is horrible way to apply the game theory. your opponents will figure what you are up to and raise you with nothing, semibluff, any piece of flop or flat call in position and take the pot away from you on turn.

sounds -evlicious to me.

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Not to mention flawed in the first place. Hero is essentially betting 110 to win 55 so villian would need to fold two thirds of the time, which seems too optimistic to me even if they only play on with the goods. And as you say above thats not a given.

[Spladle Master]

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to the person that says that's their default play with 22....why are you folding ANY hand to a button open raise, if your plan is to just pot any flop and hope they have not hit the flop, and if they do, fold to any resistance? Why not defend a button open raise with J4o?

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Because a lot of hands are trash and will not flop a hand worth risking your stack on very often. Deuces do not fall into this category. In addition, since this is a button open-raise, deuces will be winning on the majority of flops dealt. This isn't a value bet because you can't really expect worse hands to call, but it's not an outright bluff either, because your deuces will often be good when you bet.

And also, you can only fold to any resistance if you know that your opponent would not put the heat on you without a hand you beat. I have a fun story about a hand I played with 77 on a J52 flop where I put 100 BBs into the pot and was good. You've got to know your players.

J4o is a trash hand.

[Spladle Master]

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Simple math. Most hands miss most flops. And when most hands hit the flop, they hit it weakly.

This sounds profitable to me.

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This is horrible way to apply the game theory. your opponents will figure what you are up to and raise you with nothing, semibluff, any piece of flop or flat call in position and take the pot away from you on turn.

sounds -evlicious to me.

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Not to mention flawed in the first place. Hero is essentially betting 110 to win 55 so villian would need to fold two thirds of the time, which seems too optimistic to me even if they only play on with the goods. And as you say above thats not a given.

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You are ignoring the fact that sometimes you will flop a set.

[flawless_victory]

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to the person that says that's their default play with 22....why are you folding ANY hand to a button open raise, if your plan is to just pot any flop and hope they have not hit the flop, and if they do, fold to any resistance? Why not defend a button open raise with J4o?

[/ QUOTE ]if youre serious here, you really need to stop and think. this comment shows a complete lack of understanding basic NLH concepts. wow.
*hint- with 22, hero will flop a huge hand 12% of the time, and the "best" hand over 50% of the time. with J4o hell flop a huge hand almost never.

[Allinlife]

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to the person that says that's their default play with 22....why are you folding ANY hand to a button open raise, if your plan is to just pot any flop and hope they have not hit the flop, and if they do, fold to any resistance? Why not defend a button open raise with J4o?

[/ QUOTE ]if youre serious here, you really need to stop and think. this comment shows a complete lack of understanding basic NLH concepts. wow.
*hint- with 22, hero will flop a huge hand 12% of the time, and the "best" hand over 50% of the time. with J4o hell flop a huge hand almost never.

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according to spindle's logic, cept's logic works too because 50%> of the time, villan won't have a hand that can call pot sized bet with. I actaully think spindle's going somewhere with this, it may be +EV to do this once vs total unknown with any random cards even lol.

about 22 being the 'best hand' 50% of the time while it may be true, I think 22 will have huge reverse implied odds.

[flawless_victory]

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about 22 being the 'best hand' 50% of the time while it may be true, I think 22 will have huge reverse implied odds.

[/ QUOTE ]are you talking about set over set? this isnt too much of an issue in this steal situation. if you are not, then you are reeeally confused.
BTW/ i do think 22 has tremendous reverse implied odds when played from ep.

[Dr. StrangeloveX]

You mean when stacks are ridiculously deep?

[arod15]

Dependent on who it was that raised and your take. If he does this constantly this is and easy reraise. Even if he calls your prob ahead and you need to defend your blind. If this is a first time occurence i lean towards folding. Also depends if the palyer raising is a LAG TAG his stack depth. But again if this is a frequent occureence i would def come over the top otherwise i fold.

[MikeL05]

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if youre serious here, you really need to stop and think. this comment shows a complete lack of understanding basic NLH concepts. wow.
*hint- with 22, hero will flop a huge hand 12% of the time, and the "best" hand over 50% of the time. with J4o hell flop a huge hand almost never.

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The point is, it doesn't matter if the 22 is the "best" hand on the flop... because the 22 is either taking it down on the flop, or check-folding through the turn and river. The only difference between 22 and J4o, in these situations, is the 12% chance of a set, and the very small chance that (a) the button remains unpaired on the flop, (b) the button calls the flop bet unpaired, and (c) the button checks behind on the turn and river.

I think your comments show a lack of understanding of advanced NLHE concepts. The hero who plays the BB like this is not playing his own cards, he is playing on his opponent's cards.