Foxwoods 10K hand - Page 3

Lurshy · #21 11-28-2004, 12:23 PM

I have no problem with the play so far. Stan can easily put your friend on an overpair, and call here with a big overpair, or come back over-the-top with a smaller set.

Other plays such as a smooth call, or larger raise work as well in certain circumstances, but there is nothing fundamentally wrong with your friend's play that I see. JMHO

HiatusOver · #22 11-29-2004, 01:38 PM

Good discussion so far guys, I would really love to get more people to sound in on this one, because it seems like no conclusion has come and I think this situation comes up a lot early in a MTT.

Well the next part of the hand is Stan pushed in after my friend raised to 3000, my friend obviously called...what is Stans hand? And did my friend play the flop right?

SossMan · #23 11-29-2004, 02:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Well the next part of the hand is Stan pushed in after my friend raised to 3000, my friend obviously called...what is Stans hand?

[/ QUOTE ]

there are either 5 8's in the deck, your friend busted (our doubled up off of) Stan, or Stan hit a 1 outer.

SossMan · #24 11-29-2004, 02:31 PM

I believe extracting maximum value is most important in cash games while staying alive is most important in a tournament (unless there's a rebuy available, then the way you play this could change)

this is where you are clearly wrong (at least when you are far from the money).

Use the search feature...there have been many, many posts on this topic. Greg (fossilman) has a bunch of posts on this. Paul Phillips has also commented extensively on this topic. Look for posts by Fnurt, La Brujita, Che, MLG, and Cferejohn as they have argued it more elegantly than I.

when you are far from the money, for all intents and purposes chipEV = cashEV. So, giving up equity in search of survival is equatable to charity.

-SossMan

sdplayerb · #25 11-29-2004, 02:43 PM

Stan has a set of 3s or 2s, a strfl draw or AK fl draw.

And I agree with Sossman, I would have called Stan's reraise.
Due to Stan's pushin, his line was the best, but was a very unique flop given what appears to be the hands Stan has...but usually Sossman's flat call I believe is the best play.

SossMan · #26 11-29-2004, 02:59 PM

I kind of doubt Stan put in the 3rd raise w/ out a set since he has to fear AA/KK, so I don't think he can think his overcard outs are any good. Maybe w/ Ad5d or Ad4d. I really think he has a set there, though.

MLG · #27 11-29-2004, 03:25 PM

Your telling me our hero wouldnt play 99-QQ the same way? I could very easily see our opponenet having A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] here. Maybe even AQ.

cero_z · #28 11-30-2004, 05:45 AM

Hi Sossman,

[ QUOTE ]
I kind of doubt Stan put in the 3rd raise w/ out a set since he has to fear AA/KK,

[/ QUOTE ]

He doesn't, if he has AA himself. But, to me, pushing in without a set is nuts here, unless your opponent is a fool. I think he has to have a set, or he thinks the Hero is an idiot who'll call with KK.

Assuming Stan has 33 or 22, what do people think about calling 300 pre-flop in a heads up situation? At first glance, I thought it would be too hard to get paid off appropriately, but I guess it's reasonable to assume you're gonna make 2400 to 3000 post-flop with a set. Is this an easy call pre-flop for you, Sossman, even if your opponent plays well?

SossMan · #29 11-30-2004, 01:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Your telling me our hero wouldnt play 99-QQ the same way? I could very easily see our opponenet having A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] here. Maybe even AQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think most players would make the non-allin rereraise with 99-QQ. I suppose he could have made that play, but hero sure is screaming set/AA/KK.
I would be shocked if Stan didn't have a set or AA.

SossMan · #30 11-30-2004, 01:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Assuming Stan has 33 or 22, what do people think about calling 300 pre-flop in a heads up situation? At first glance, I thought it would be too hard to get paid off appropriately, but I guess it's reasonable to assume you're gonna make 2400 to 3000 post-flop with a set. Is this an easy call pre-flop for you, Sossman, even if your opponent plays well?

[/ QUOTE ]

standard deep stacked play, IMO. I would call there just about every time given the stack sizes.