The Most Donkeyfied Play I"ve ever made-Please punish me severely

[Slim Pickens]

You make a good point about dead money. The thing I like about AA is that so many hands can "hit" the flop, willing to go to the felt, and still be way behind AA. Even when they flop two pair, it still has a lot of outs.

Numbers here would be good. I'll defer to someone with a licenced copy of Poker Stove. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

[binions]

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Look at what ended up in the all-in pot: a flush draw and an inside straight draw along with the made set. Why would you ever want to fold such retarded opponents, who will minraise non-nut flush draws and call all-in with a gutshot, out of a pot? I submit that to all of you who want to push preflop.

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What makes you think they all fold preflop to an obvious steal attempt from the Big Blind if they are calling with such garbage on the flop.

This is an easy push preflop. And it's not even close.

[microbet]

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I'll defer to someone with a licenced copy of Poker Stove. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Pokerstove is free. You don't have to be embarrased that you don't have a copy.

[Slim Pickens]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'll defer to someone with a licenced copy of Poker Stove. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Pokerstove is free. You don't have to be embarrased that you don't have a copy.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think I just pwned myself. Thanks.

I really am surprised that there are regular posters on this forum who don't feel the need to isolate with AA. Why not just limp/slowplay them every time and curse your bad beats?

[Slim Pickens]

AA is 85% against one random hand and ~70% against two random hands (somebody is learnding PokerStove). Even against three random hands it's about 64%. A 64% edge is easily enough to take at any stage of a tournament for even money. With AA it's getting 3:1. I understand the idea of isolating with a weaker hand. 40% to triple up is still +cEV, but you won't be successful in the SNG payout structure (read: -$EV) pushing with a 40% chance to triple up. You'd much rather take the 65% chance to double up you would get folding out a weaker (25% in a three-way pot) hand. Please explain why I want to isolate with AA.

SlimP

[microbet]

In this case I would push, but I certainly don't want to always isolate with AA. I think it boils down to what odds are you offering your opponents and in this case you are pretty clearly offering them good odds (at least a second caller) and thus you are giving up your hard bad-beat earned Sklansky dollars.

With a raiser and two callers before you, these are not "random" hands. I'd still rather isolate ESPECIALLY if someone has shown strength because I can likely get them to put a lot of their chips in with an underpair or a dominated hand. I understand that AA is still a decent favorite in a 3-4 way pot but I'd rather exploit the biggest edge I can. And if you happen to scare them away, well the dead money in the pot is half your stack.

Your logic implies that limping with AA in MP and hoping that those behind you do the same is desired.

When the flop comes coordinated/suited - you may still hold up, but you'll wish you had pushed preflop.

You may be a great poker player, but your advice here is completely counterintuitive to me.

[Slim Pickens]

I'm not advocating limping AA anywhere. I like the raise, and hate the limp. There's not really any correct way to play this hand that allows you to fold it at any point. The debate here is how much to raise. Since you can't fold, I say the raise should be enough that a number of players (not everyone, but up to 3 for sure) might be induced to call. It's definitely better to err on the side of raising too much rather than too little, 250 is plenty here to get the correct value. Don't forget we are gambling here.

No one who reads this board regularly is going to mistake me for a great player.

[jeffraider]

I probably make it 300 or 325 preflop but I play it basically the same. I also tend to win monster pots with AA all the time.