Bubbling

[Jason Strasser]

Nice situation. I love this stuff.

In my experience, a big stack here does not like calling the all in with mediocre hands. If you raise anything less than all in, the big stack should, and will push you all in (I would with 23o).

This is a raise/fold situation. The poster who suggested limping in is wrong, because a smart bigstack will just push all in.

Your main objective here is to steal the blinds. You do NOT want to be called in this spot. However, if you do get called, AK stands a fair shot, and is slightly favored or a coinflip with any hand (cept AAKK, u knew that).

I raise all in here. You will get respect. If you get called by 22 and lose, thats rough. But I think in the long run two things will happen:

1) You will steal blinds and those are wonderful
2) You will double up against maybe a loose call

Sure you will bust, but I think as a big stack in that spot, I fold most of my hands. That raise gets the ultimate respect.

[Prickly Pete]

Thanks for all the responses.

I decided to go the famed Zee Justin route of "F*** 3rd Place" and got greedy. Rather than go allin and get called by his best 30%(?), I decided to induce the reraise by raising to 275. Sure enough, he comes over the top allin and I call. Unfortunately, he has a hand this time - JJ. And I get no help.

The more I think about it, I still think it's close either way. Although, I'd really like my play better if I had a big pair.

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

I decided to go the famed Zee Justin route of "F*** 3rd Place"

Folding here, in this specific situation, is not "playing for 3rd place."

And just to counter the "F 3rd place" argument. 1st place is only 2.5x 3rd place. 3rd place is infinitely bigger than 4th place.

[Jason Strasser]

Folding here is weak. I understand the situation on the bubble, yadda yadda, but folding is downright weak. I can not believe people are considering it. Pushing all in seems like the best overall play, second to inducing an all in push from the big stack. Folding is a distant third.

[jaybee_70]

It's weak to let a player who doesn't have enough chips to make it through the blinds back his way into the money. Kurn is right here. Wait 3 hands to be aggressive.
Joe

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

Unless you think the big stack will fold more than half the time you raise all-in, anything other than folding is just a stupid gambling play.

To quote Tommy Angelo: "I'd rather be weak-tight than strong-broke."

That quote fits this circumstance perfectly.

[Beavis68]

Well, do you went to win it? Is your bankroll big enough for 200+15?

I would go all-in, and hope he calls. You aren't going to win this without doubling up, and you will have enough chips to make him think. If you pick up the pot here, you will be on nearly equal footing with him, and that should take a lot of the fire out of his sails.

If you fold here, you are missing a good opponturnity to double up.

That is how I would play it at MY level, but I don't play 215s. but the right play is the right play regardless of level.

If you fold, I feel you are surrendering 1st place. The money is so much better for first than it is for 3rd, I think it is worth the chance.

[PrayingMantis]

Jason,

I think this hand is very close, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if folding is the highest $EV move.

That's why I'll put this to you this way:

Same exact hand, only UTG has 50 chips (not very different from what he has), and big stack on BB will call all-in or raise you all-in with ANYTHING.

Do you still think folding is weak, and the bubble is yadda yadda? I'm really behind you with "the bubble is your friend" attitude, that's how I play. However, the bubble is a real entity. 35% percent of busting here and not making the money, and let mini-stack cash instead of you, is not neccesarily comparable $EV-wise to the chips you earn when you do double up.

The scenario above is very similar to the real hand, as PP has described it, only a little more extreme.

Opinions?

[Beavis68]

[ QUOTE ]
I decided to go the famed Zee Justin route of "F*** 3rd Place"

Folding here, in this specific situation, is not "playing for 3rd place."

And just to counter the "F 3rd place" argument. 1st place is only 2.5x 3rd place. 3rd place is infinitely bigger than 4th place.

[/ QUOTE ]

3rd place is a profit of $185 1st is a profit of 785 - that is is a 4.24x

[Beavis68]

[ QUOTE ]
It's weak to let a player who doesn't have enough chips to make it through the blinds back his way into the money. Kurn is right here. Wait 3 hands to be aggressive.
Joe

[/ QUOTE ]

There is no gaurantee that the short stack will go out - what do you do if he triples up? I have seen that happen over and over again.