50/100 vs mahatma - Page 2

ripdog · #1 12-05-2005, 05:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
But mahatma is known for bluffing in this situation, often all-in.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have only seen Mahatma play a few hundred hands, but he has pushed it all-in EVERY TIME that he got to the turn and there was more than $5K in the pot. Is this what happened? I would insta-call his push and expect to be ahead most of the time.

citanul · #2 12-05-2005, 05:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But mahatma is known for bluffing in this situation, often all-in.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have only seen Mahatma play a few hundred hands, but he has pushed it all-in EVERY TIME that he got to the turn and there was more than $5K in the pot. Is this what happened? I would insta-call his push and expect to be ahead most of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

dude, you haven't seen very many hands i think is the problem here. particularly not deeper stacked hands.

as for "his push" he didn't make one in this hand up to now, as far as i can tell it's hero to act on the turn.

c

durrrr · #3 12-06-2005, 01:39 AM

[ QUOTE ]
But mahatma is known for bluffing in this situation, often all-in.

[/ QUOTE ]

True, which is why i checked the turn.

durrrr · #4 12-06-2005, 01:40 AM

i checked he bet 3600. My action now?

Ulysses · #5 12-06-2005, 04:22 AM

durr,

"it was about the BB, it is not an important part of the hand. Prah knew why i did it- and it doesnt give away any huge tells or anything like that. I cant go into more detail w/o giving wayy too much away. "

Someday I hope to get to this level of complex multi-level thinking where things that are not important to the hand are known by other opponents in the hand but are too secret to go into detail about. This sounds like really awesome multilevel metagame stuff or something. It's like, you and Prah have this level of play going on here and are just toying with the helpless BB in ways that most of us on this forum couldn't even begin to comprehend. I hope someday you are able to give us a hint of detail about the complex stuff going on here.

Rococo · #6 12-05-2005, 01:34 PM

This decision depends so much on flow and game play that I suspect you had a better sense of what to do in the moment that anyone can give you on this board now. That being said, I'll give it a whirl.

For a certain type of player, your smallish flop bet means one of two things -- either you flopped a set (probably kings) and are hoping that a weak lead will draw a reraise, or you have TT-QQ and hope that he completely whiffed. I don't have any idea whether Mahatma views you as this type of player, but maybe so given your description of the hands where you flopped a set.

Either way, if you lead the turn, I feel that he is going to give you credit for a hand. Put another way, I don't see him raising you on the turn (which is the real fear here) unless he beats a hand like AK.

If you check the turn, I think that he is going to check behind a lot of the time. Still, you are going to be in a difficult spot on the river because guys like Mahatma eat blocking bets for the lunch.

All things considered, if you think that he will read you as I described above, I vote for 3/4 pot bet on the turn. I would have hate to give him a free one if he has something like 67 here.

citanul · #7 12-05-2005, 05:39 PM

durrrr,

almost all of the hands i've watched or read of mahatmas are from shorter handed play. in such play he can have almost any (and often does) two cards after his preflop reraise. does that change when he's playing closer to full, particularly against a raiser from utg? does that change against you in specific?

c

neon · #8 12-05-2005, 06:56 PM

[ QUOTE ]
BB is fanta, and the flop bet has its reasons. As for history vs prah:

1) i've stacked him i believe twice in 25/50 when i flopped sets and played them slow (somewhat). Also he made a sick thin value bet vs me (1 card J hi flush vs my T hi flush) for a 20k pot ~10min before this (it was hu... fanta sat out for 2secs).

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $100 BB (6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

SB ($9791)
BB ($14245)
Hero ($22666)
MP ($10050)
CO ($42615)
Button ($35180)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Hero raises to $350, 1 fold, CO raises to $1200, 2 folds, BB calls $1100, Hero calls $850.

Flop: ($3650) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1600, CO calls $1600, BB folds.

Turn: ($6850) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players) 
Hero (19k he covr) ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey durrrr,

Do you think you're ahead on the turn here? Or, I suppose the more pertinent question is, Are you willing to go broke w/ your hand vs. Mahat here?

Because you know these things better than we can from the peanut gallery, and as you and anyone else who's ever played v. Mahatma knows, his range for calling behind on a flop such as this vs. an aggro player like yourself is [censored] huuuuuuuuuge.

That said, if my intuitions about the reasoning behind your flop bet are correct, then I kind of fancy check/call the turn, and then faux block-bet/value bet the river and call a raise . . .

-neon

Rococo · #9 12-05-2005, 07:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Hey durrrr,

Do you think you're ahead on the turn here? Or, I suppose the more pertinent question is, Are you willing to go broke w/ your hand vs. Mahat here?

Because you know these things better than we can from the peanut gallery, and as you and anyone else who's ever played v. Mahatma knows, his range for calling behind on a flop such as this vs. an aggro player like yourself is [censored] huuuuuuuuuge.

That said, if my intuitions about the reasoning behind your flop bet are correct, then I kind of fancy check/call the turn, and then faux block-bet/value bet the river and call a raise . . .

-neon

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that you and I are advocating different lines based on exactly the same reasoning about Mahatma's perspective on durrr's hand range. I now think that your line is more profitable, although higher variance.

BobboFitos · #10 12-05-2005, 10:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]
That said, if my intuitions about the reasoning behind your flop bet are correct, then I kind of fancy check/call the turn, and then faux block-bet/value bet the river and call a raise . . .

-neon

[/ QUOTE ]

imo that is the most vital part, it would not be bet/fold, it would be bet/call, because calling the turn to lead the river is the most easily recognizable showdown line, and obv hat will pick up on it, and thus could raise w/ nothing (if he was bluffing the turn)

that in fact could be the best line.