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#11
09-15-2005, 02:57 AM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
i mean, aside from ICM, the results of which are unknown to me, this could be good IF a) you haven't played a hand in awhile; b) the players in the blinds have tight calling ranges; and/or c) you think you have pretty decent FE.
In short, a hand like this really depends on the table situation as a whole I feel... 
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#12
09-15-2005, 03:01 AM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure if ICM really says that... [/ QUOTE ] I 2nd that.
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#13
09-15-2005, 04:21 AM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
This is probably a fold with KQs.
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#14
09-15-2005, 09:28 AM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
utg with 6 after you and you still have 7bbs? i'd say it's -ev by icm if u input the correct ranges
u prolly have their calling ranges on tight or aggressive i've found that, in general, when you have around 5bbs is when you can start pushing first in with any 2 decent hands (top 70% or so when u are button) each seat away from the blinds that you are should tighten up your pushing range until you get down to 3-4 bbs, at which point it starts becoming any2 from any seat first in the pot
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#15
09-15-2005, 09:35 AM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
ICM is just a chip model. It doesn't take position into account, right?
In LP, I push push this all the time. In EP, on most tables, I fold with extreme predjudice. Pushing 700 with KT into a 150 pot with tons of people to act behind you = -EV. Don't use ICM blindly... ICM + Brain = +++EV
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#16
09-15-2005, 09:40 AM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
i think he's using sngpt, which takes into account position, the opps' calling ranges and how well your particular hand does against those calling ranges when you are called that % of the time...
it's accurate, but it's only as good as its input, which i believe is flawed by putting opps on too tight of a calling range
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#17
09-15-2005, 12:53 PM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
Sometimes I push, sometimes not. Depends on how many hands I have pushed lately. That is close, though, with 7BB UTG. Also, if seats 4 or 5 are loose callers, I muck. You have a lot of FE here if they are not loose callers, since everyone else has a stack that is really hurt (or wiped out) by doubling you up.
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#20
09-15-2005, 01:20 PM
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Re: ICM says so but do you push here?
[ QUOTE ]
i think he's using sngpt, which takes into account position, the opps' calling ranges and how well your particular hand does against those calling ranges when you are called that % of the time... it's accurate, but it's only as good as its input, which i believe is flawed by putting opps on too tight of a calling range [/ QUOTE ] Well, the OP says ICM, not SNGPT, but fair enough. Assuming he is using SNGPT which does take positing into account, I'll give my .02$ again. SNGPT is just an overly-simplistic model that doesn't take all aspects of the game into account such as "when will the blinds increase?", "do I really need to risk my stack to take the blinds this round?", "is the player immediately to my left easy to steal from?", "is the player immediately to his left also easy to steal from?", "Will there be better spots in the near future to get my money in?", and so on. You say: [ QUOTE ] it's accurate, but it's only as good as its input [/ QUOTE ] I believe it is accurate, but incomplete as all models are (if they weren't, they wouldn't be models). I think it is a good guide IF used in conjuction with your brain. If SNGPT moves were as perfect as some believe they are, the $215's would be infested with winning bots that are driven using the SNGPT logic. Don't take this post as bashing SNGPT... I think it's great. I also think that thinking is also great [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] So, despite what SNGPT says, I'd consider folding, but might push depending on all other factors.
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