Gamble or not? Live 1/2, deepstacks, good opponents - Page 2

JihadOnTheRiver · #1 08-24-2005, 08:23 PM

I'm with the "take the pot now crowd." I like money, and I'm pretty sure there's a good deal of it in there now. You never know you might get a call.

On a tangent: I really don't consider this to be "deep stacked". I'm kinda getting tired of the over-use of this term. Maybe a qualifier of "somewhat" deepstacks, but I don't really consider 2xBuyin to be that deep. Its nothing that would truly change my play. Now at the casinos I play in there is usually two or three people that are at a $200 table with $700+. That, to me, is deep. Am I just wrong?

PokerFink · #2 08-24-2005, 08:36 PM

You're right, it's borderline deepstacked. Then again, considering that so many online hands are played against shortstacked opponents, it's rare to see a hand involving multiple people with even 100BB, let alone 200BB.

bobbyi · #3 08-24-2005, 08:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
But here's the biggest problem. I am certain that if I push all-in, SB will muck his kings.

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No, you're not. After playing with someone for just a few hours, there is no way you can be sure of this. You are projecting your own knowledge of your play onto him. Even though you've been playing tight here, he will probably call with his kings. You should push.

Rockatansky · #4 08-24-2005, 09:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But here's the biggest problem. I am certain that if I push all-in, SB will muck his kings.

[/ QUOTE ]
No, you're not. After playing with someone for just a few hours, there is no way you can be sure of this. You are projecting your own knowledge of your play onto him. Even though you've been playing tight here, he will probably call with his kings. You should push.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. Plus, I think you're overestimating your implied odds. If SB good, is he going to dump his 200BB stack to you with just a high pair?

PokerFink · #5 08-24-2005, 10:06 PM

That was my read guys. I felt very confident that if I slowplayed the SB, he would be unable to get away from his kings since he would not know whether I held QQ or AA, but if I came over the top he would put me on exactly AA and get away from it. You can disagree all you want, but that was my read.

This hand is very straightfoward against just the SB. I'm asking, what do you do if the EP player comes in as well?

djoyce003 · #6 08-24-2005, 10:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
That was my read guys. I felt very confident that if I slowplayed the SB, he would be unable to get away from his kings since he would not know whether I held QQ or AA, but if I came over the top he would put me on exactly AA and get away from it. You can disagree all you want, but that was my read.

This hand is very straightfoward against just the SB. I'm asking, what do you do if the EP player comes in as well?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you are overestimating their donk-iness. If these people are good enough to not call your all in with KK or QQ then there is no way they are paying off post flop either. When someone makes a large re-raise in a multi-way pot and another person cold calls it multiway, then I slow WAY down because there is a REALLY good chance that person has AA...at worst KK. Kind of like a multiway pot and the flop is something like JJ5. The original preflop raiser bets, some dude raises, and then someone cold-calls the raise...you know the guy that coldcalls has a J. The right play here is to push preflop....you are giving reverse implied odds otherwise and you are opening yourself up to make a post flop mistake by folding the best hand.

wtfsvi · #7 08-24-2005, 10:08 PM

Given your reads (He has KK. If you push you will take down the pot preflop or get a call and split. And if you smooth call he will put you on AA-QQ and will therefore put in more money that way.), smooth call and get away if a K flops is right. There isn't much to discuss really. Except that your reads seem awfully accurate. He is sure easy to read for such a very good player, wouldn't you say?

EDIT: The real question is wheather the LAG's presens changes this from a call to a push since you won't know where you're at against him. If he will put you on AA-QQ as well when you smooth call, then maybe his presense changes it to reraise.

Allinlife · #8 08-24-2005, 10:44 PM

raise 100$ on top and you won't have to play any guessing games on the flop.

Although there is a decent chance of you stacking them both if board comes lowcards in position, but then again, they will read you for a set because of your image or something and make some huge laydown.. I really think 100$ raise on top is the way to go here.

PokerFink · #9 08-25-2005, 01:29 AM

[ QUOTE ]
EDIT: The real question is wheather the LAG's presens changes this from a call to a push since you won't know where you're at against him. If he will put you on AA-QQ as well when you smooth call, then maybe his presense changes it to reraise.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Quote from Pokerfink: This hand is very straightfoward against just the SB. I'm asking, what do you do if the EP player comes in as well?

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for repeating my question for me. I wasn't quite sure what I was asking.

(Sorry, I just coulden't let this post slide without a smartass comment)

wtfsvi · #10 08-25-2005, 09:25 AM

Yeah, that was really kindof stupid. I blame that it was 5 in the morning. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

I've read the results, and while smooth-calling is certainly correct after EP folds, just that SB says he would've gotten away from kings doesn't mean he would get away from them. (If EP called and you pushed.)