18 Player $100 Buy In Tournament - Difficult Situation - Page 2

HitmanHoldem · #11 07-30-2005, 10:05 PM

I must agree with that statement. The truth is though, I really didn't spot any great situations where a raise would've taken down a pot, or where it was even worth the shot. The game is played relatively slow as you can see because I was only blinded down about 15 bucks in 3 hours.

I stayed away from some troublesome situations when I had AJ and folded to a raise and call and an Ace had flopped but I was beat by AK.

But anyways, to what my questions actually was, about the KK situation...anyone else have any other suggestions on what I could've done?

ZBTHorton · #12 07-30-2005, 10:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I must agree with that statement. The truth is though, I really didn't spot any great situations where a raise would've taken down a pot, or where it was even worth the shot. The game is played relatively slow as you can see because I was only blinded down about 15 bucks in 3 hours.

I stayed away from some troublesome situations when I had AJ and folded to a raise and call and an Ace had flopped but I was beat by AK.

But anyways, to what my questions actually was, about the KK situation...anyone else have any other suggestions on what I could've done?

[/ QUOTE ]

You were going broke.

Deal with it. Everyone so far has said it, and nobody here is going to even come close to claiming you could have folded.

This whole thread makes me think two things:

1. People like you, shows that poker is still going to be profitable.
2. This is a joke.

Annulus · #13 07-30-2005, 10:27 PM

Funny thread. If after 3 hours blinds were 1/2, what did you guys start off at .01/.02?

ZBTHorton · #14 07-30-2005, 10:30 PM

Yeah, this was the greatest blind structure in the history of home tournaments.

HitmanHoldem · #15 07-30-2005, 10:40 PM

Haha, they were really low.

.25/50 First Hour
.50/1.00 Second Hour
.75/1.50 Third Hour
1.00/2.00 Fourth Hour

Then going to 2/4, 3/6 etc.

And sorry for the dumb question, but I really didn't think it was. I mean, I go broke on the hand unless I fold pre flop, but I guess there was no action besides folding on which it would've been the right move. I thought he might've had aces because a simliar situation happened earlier where he smooth called a big bet pre flop with aces.

Honestly though, if I do raise him there, say another 20, or somethign close to min, I honestly feel that he only pushes with the Aces. If he calls, I'll lose anyway, but if he pushes, I can get away, and now knowing what he had, there's no question he would've pushed.

Guess I'll stop asking since no one is going to agree, but I guess since people aren't there and don't know the reads on specific players and weren't there for some of their previous hands it's hard to ask a question like this. Usually it's a no brainer to put all your chips in pre flop with KK, but I feel I could've found a way out of this one.

Annulus · #16 07-30-2005, 10:45 PM

you seem like a nice guy. the reason most of us here cant help you much is that in a 18 man tourney like this , and this pay structure there really is no justifiable cause to fold KK preflop. So, take your medicine like a big boy and move on.

Also, this blind structure is different. Let me guess, you guys use real currency instead of chips? actually nothing wrong with that. later/

ZBTHorton · #17 07-30-2005, 10:55 PM

There are very few times in poker you should ever fold KK pre-flop, especially HU.

If your read on the person is THAT strong. Stronger than any pros read on any player. Stronger than any advice we can give. Then I don't see why you are posting.

HitmanHoldem · #18 07-30-2005, 11:03 PM

To the first of the last two responses, yes, we use currency usually in tournaments. Just what we've done the past 5-6 years, so we've stuck with it.

To the last poster who has been on my back all night, you make it seem like no one can lay down KK pre flop. At the WSOP this year, Hellmuth had AK with a flop of AA4 and lays down his hand to what he claims was a full boat.

I'm not saying my read was that strong, but I always feel one of the worst moves is all in w.o the nuts since you leave yoruself the chance to go broke, and I could've played it differently. He had smooth called a huge raise PF with AA before, he seemed kinda nervous with his eyes wandering all over the place, so I kinad felt he had a good hand. I guess my feeling wasn't good enough since I did make the call, showing I'm not THAT pro who can't ask for advice.

Guess I won't ask any more questions on here if all people do is jump on yoru back. I notice a lot of posts get belittled because some people just think they're too good to answer a post like that. If you think it's a bad question, why not just look at the next post and move on? Just a thought...

ekky · #19 07-30-2005, 11:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
To the last poster who has been on my back all night, you make it seem like no one can lay down KK pre flop. At the WSOP this year, Hellmuth had AK with a flop of AA4 and lays down his hand to what he claims was a full boat.

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe the flop was A44. If he folds AK on an AA4 flop, he gets more delusional by the nano-second

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not saying my read was that strong, but I always feel one of the worst moves is all in w.o the nuts since you leave yoruself the chance to go broke, and I could've played it differently. He had smooth called a huge raise PF with AA before, he seemed kinda nervous with his eyes wandering all over the place, so I kinad felt he had a good hand. I guess my feeling wasn't good enough since I did make the call, showing I'm not THAT pro who can't ask for advice.

[/ QUOTE ]

You asked for advice, got it, and seemingly tended to ignore it, or contest it because it didn't show concurrence with your perspective.

to fold KK.. you need to be 100% sure he has AA. If you are that sure, then by all means go ahead and fold, its your money.

One final point, if you think its "one of the worst moves" to get all your chips in without the nuts, you are really going to struggle in tournaments that aren't against complete idiots.. so you might want to revise such an opinion.

[ QUOTE ]
Guess I won't ask any more questions on here if all people do is jump on yoru back. I notice a lot of posts get belittled because some people just think they're too good to answer a post like that. If you think it's a bad question, why not just look at the next post and move on? Just a thought...

[/ QUOTE ]

I think they get tired of people asking for opinions/advice, when there really isn't a lot of advice to give/solicit.

The only way you fold here is if you are 100% sure he has AA. If you aren't that sure, you must call. Thats what it boils down to... and no other assertions will alter this fact.

Given that its nigh on impossible to be 100% sure of someones holding (because its a game of incomplete information), that means the call is almost obligatory.

Iconoclastic · #20 07-30-2005, 11:21 PM

What hand could the Villain hold that he could cold call an open push with? AA, AK? I can't imagine much else. Since you didn't say anything about his stack size or playing style I assume Villain was not a gigantic stack or an idiot.

Add that to your "read", you don't need to be 100% sure he has AA to fold, only ~55% or so, after taking into account the dead money in the pot, to fold.