blind defense with KT - Page 2

topspin · #11 07-16-2005, 07:35 PM

I think a pair of tens has a decent chance to be good against a blind steal from the CO.

I prefer leading the turn rather than check-calling, especially this scary board, since I'm unlikely to be raised unless villain has a monster and I didn't want to give naked overcards a free card. I'm mulling the flop check-raise option in my head, though.

Shillx · #12 07-16-2005, 07:44 PM

One of the best ways to defend blinds (at least against aggressive players) is to check/call all the way with any pair. This turn looks like an easy check/call and then check (planning to call) again on the river. I guess you could bet the river as well. If he checks behind on the turn you should bet most river cards.

Brad

Edit - The best time to check/raise the flop is when you either have nothing or when you have a strong hand like a set. Suppose that you have 98s and the flop is A76. Now is a good time to check/raise and hope that you fold out a hand like KQ or QJ or something. Even if he has an ace, you still have 8 wins in the deck and you know exactly where you stand should you get 3-bet or called. If you have A2s on that same flop you should tend to check/call since the KQ or QJ is drawing super thin. Let him throw his money away. And if he has you outkicked, you save money by playing it this way. Also, if you have 66 on that flop it might be worth it to check/raise in case he has AK or something and just spews all of his chips away to you.

Greg J · #13 07-16-2005, 08:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
One of the best ways to defend blinds (at least against aggressive players) is to check/call all the way with any pair. This turn looks like an easy check/call and then check (planning to call) again on the river. I guess you could bet the river as well. If he checks behind on the turn you should bet most river cards.

Brad

Edit - The best time to check/raise the flop is when you either have nothing or when you have a strong hand like a set. Suppose that you have 98s and the flop is A76. Now is a good time to check/raise and hope that you fold out a hand like KQ or QJ or something. Even if he has an ace, you still have 8 wins in the deck and you know exactly where you stand should you get 3-bet or called. If you have A2s on that same flop you should tend to check/call since the KQ or QJ is drawing super thin. Let him throw his money away. And if he has you outkicked, you save money by playing it this way. Also, if you have 66 on that flop it might be worth it to check/raise in case he has AK or something and just spews all of his chips away to you.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is one of the best posts I have read in weeks. Thanks Brad!

Shillx · #14 07-16-2005, 08:49 PM

The general idea is that you should play pairs slow in small pots against aggressive opponents. Take a look at a typical example...

You (a good TAG) open raise in the CO with AK [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] and super fish calls from the BB with 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].

Flop - Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] - Check-bet-call
Turn - 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] - Check-bet-call
River - 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] - Check-check and HHIG

You sit there and say to yourself, "Damn fish called me down with bottom pair, why can't my raises get any repect!" Well you know what...this is how he should have played the hand, and this is what you should do to against aggressive players in small pots. Throw your hand into the muck when you don't hit a pair or a draw and let them throw their money away by betting overcards into a tiny pot when you do find something. If they hit a 3 or 6 outer against you in a 3 BB pot, so what? You don't need to be aggressive here since a) if you get drawn out on it isn't a big deal and b) you can count on the other guy to be aggressive no matter what he holds. Become the "fish" in this spot and you will get rewarded.

Brad

istewart · #15 07-16-2005, 08:56 PM

Shill,

Betting most turns if you check/raise a A76 flop with 98 and he calls (Heads-up)?

Shillx · #16 07-16-2005, 08:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Shill,

Betting most turns if you check/raise a A76 flop with 98 and he calls (Heads-up)?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I would though I do expect the flop check/raise to fold KQ then and there. Sometimes he might make a loose call though and fold the turn UI. Obviously I'm not putting anymore money in should he call me again on 4th street (and I don't find anything). If he raises the turn I call and check/raise the river when I hit the straight.

Brad

topspin · #17 07-16-2005, 09:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If they hit a 3 or 6 outer against you in a 3 BB pot, so what?You don't need to be aggressive here since a) if you get drawn out on it isn't a big deal and b) you can count on the other guy to be aggressive no matter what he holds.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hadn't really thought about it this way before but it does make sense. Thanks!

[ QUOTE ]
River - 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] - Check-check and HHIG

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you therefore agree with the WA/WB line of leading out on the river then?

GrunchCan · #18 07-25-2005, 12:56 PM

Preflop I prefer 3-betting and then leading the flop no matter what comes. Given the way you actually played PF, I like check-call/check-call/bet.

topspin · #19 07-25-2005, 03:30 PM

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Preflop I prefer 3-betting and then leading the flop no matter what comes.

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Mind if I ask why?

With SB in the pot also, we're looking at 9SB on the flop. The odds that I'll be able to take this down with a continuation bet on the flop look pretty small to me. If we whiff and get 1 caller on the flop, then aren't we committed to firing again if we want to keep making a move at the pot? This possibly commits us to spewing a lot of chips.

With the flat call preflop, I'm figuring we can take a look at the flop and then decide how we want to play it. It also keeps the pot small if we want to make a play at the pot on a later street.

Saint_D · #20 07-26-2005, 01:24 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Preflop I prefer 3-betting and then leading the flop no matter what comes.

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Mind if I ask why?

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Let me try to channel Grunchan. I will probably get it wrong, but he can yell at me later.

3 bet the flop becuase you have the best hand here. So many people have folded that the raiser would raise with a wide range of hands as a steal or semi bluff. If he re-raises you can narrow down his holdings a lot.

Leading out the flop gives you fold equity or you can take a free card on the turn if you need it.

Taken together the 3 bet + lead-the-flop puts you in control of this hand.

-D