pre-flop decision

[maxpowers21]

PS, Im also having trouble puttign him on hands that i beat, other then a flush draw, that he would 3bet preflop, and check raise me on this board.

I mean of course he can be open-ended or just have a flush dra, but i beleive more often then not he will have paint here.

P.S. Also, after thinking this over more i think its close between folding and continuing here, because i do have some added equity with the ten of hearts.

[MrTeddyKGB]

you have have about 4 outs if you are behind which is enough to call on the flop if you are behind, than and the
extra chance to draw out on the river plus the opp is way
too loose pre-flop and you may be ahead you should at the very least see the turn and often call down. If you fold these kind of hands on the flop you open youself to some pretty expensive semi-bluffs.

[MrTeddyKGB]

[ QUOTE ]
PS, Im also having trouble puttign him on hands that i beat, other then a flush draw, that he would 3bet preflop, and check raise me on this board.

[/ QUOTE ]
22, 44, 55, 66, 77, 88, 99, A10, Q10, Q9, AQ, 2hearts


[ QUOTE ]
I mean of course he can be open-ended or just have a flush dra, but i beleive more often then not he will have paint here

[/ QUOTE ]

So what even if it is 75-25 that he has you beat you cant fold the flop.

[ QUOTE ]
P.S. Also, after thinking this over more i think its close between folding and continuing here, because i do have some added equity with the ten of hearts.

[/ QUOTE ]

You also can make a strait or a set. He may check the turn. A king may come on the turn making it less likley he has one.

[maxpowers21]

[ QUOTE ]
you have have about 4 outs if you are behind which is enough to call on the flop if you are behind, than and the
extra chance to draw out on the river plus the opp is way
too loose pre-flop and you may be ahead you should at the very least see the turn and often call down. If you fold these kind of hands on the flop you open youself to some pretty expensive semi-bluffs.

[/ QUOTE ]

ageed. But i don't think i would count a full 4 outs when behind here, it would be slightly less, but i think your last line might be the best of all reasons to call here.

Curious though what would be the play if i don't have a heart?

[maxpowers21]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
PS, Im also having trouble puttign him on hands that i beat, other then a flush draw, that he would 3bet preflop, and check raise me on this board.

[/ QUOTE ]
22, 44, 55, 66, 77, 88, 99, A10, Q10, Q9, AQ, 2hearts


[ QUOTE ]
I mean of course he can be open-ended or just have a flush dra, but i beleive more often then not he will have paint here

[/ QUOTE ]

So what even if it is 75-25 that he has you beat you cant fold the flop.

[ QUOTE ]
P.S. Also, after thinking this over more i think its close between folding and continuing here, because i do have some added equity with the ten of hearts.

[/ QUOTE ]

You also can make a strait or a set. He may check the turn. A king may come on the turn making it less likley he has one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again i don't beleive that a player with his aggresion numbers is going to raise a capped pot with these types of pairs 22-99 on this paint flop, is this debatable or am i just flat wrong? I woudl like soem more input on what these aggresion numbers mean then if i am.

I definately agree with you ont he 2nd point, my odds+ chance that I'm good make it a call on the flop, however, The turn becomes much more dificult a decsion, so my efective odds are really much worse for a calldown because I will end up paying 2.5 BB's for a calldown greatly reducing my odds, and when I am good here, if he is semi-bluffing reverse implied odds will cut further into my pot equity.

So i think a call is correct on the flop, but a calldown, I don't know i'd have to crunch some math for that, my intuition tells me that it wouldn't be correct to call down unimproved though depending on the turn card....

[sam h]

Capping preflop is better and its not really close. You have a big equity edge over his range of hands, and you don't have the type of Grade A hammer (AA, KK) that is conducive to slowplaying and gaining extra bets later. There are too many boards with overcards, in which trying to recoup bets after the flop becomes tricky. As you noted in another post, capping preflop also makes the hand easier to play. For instance, I think the suggestion somebody else made that this guy could have 22 or AQ is pretty unlikely. He's not that aggressive, you capped, and now he's coming after you. He's got you beat >75% of the time here, IMO, and has a heart draw or OESD the other times.

In this case, I would still call the flop and see what comes off on the turn. You have a lot of backdoor draws, and you don't want to make it seem so easy to move you off a hand you capped preflop.

[MrTeddyKGB]

[ QUOTE ]
So i think a call is correct on the flop, but a calldown, I don't know i'd have to crunch some math for that, my intuition tells me that it wouldn't be correct to call down unimproved though depending on the turn card....

[/ QUOTE ]

I did not say I would call down everytime I would need a read beyond regular PT stats. I was just saying it for emphisis to show that folding to the flop is not good. Usually I would see what the turn was then decide. But I dont think this is a auto fold. As if you were UTG in a full game.