Consecutive All-In situations. need critique please. - Page 2

cs3 · #11 06-30-2005, 03:03 AM

Well, I had about the pot left in my stack and I pushed.
I thouhgt this would look like either AcXc for nut flush or KK for top set, and only expected a call if he had actually made a flush or was holding KK himself or JJ (both unlikely given my cards and my read on him)

He took a loooong time then finally folded. I let a huge sigh of relief knowing I shouldnt have got myslef into that situation and being very fortunate to win the pot.

Posthand Chat:
Him: fush?
Me: good laydown
Him: thank god, it was really hard throwing away a set

Do you like the push?
If you are villain what would you have done? do you throw it away too? or do call you call, laughing all the way to the bank at the donk you are about to stack.

cs3 · #12 06-30-2005, 03:24 AM

thinking about it a little more, since i was willing to put all my money in on the river anyway, I think maybe a check raise all-in on the turn would have been the best play. If he checks, i couldve checked behind and got away from my hand cheaply on the river if i missed, or still got in the money if i hit. And the checkraise would better represent flsuh here i think. The more think about the better that line looks to me.... thoughts?

TheWorstPlayer · #13 06-30-2005, 08:20 AM

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thinking about it a little more, since i was willing to put all my money in on the river anyway, I think maybe a check raise all-in on the turn would have been the best play. If he checks, i couldve checked behind and got away from my hand cheaply on the river if i missed, or still got in the money if i hit. And the checkraise would better represent flsuh here i think. The more think about the better that line looks to me.... thoughts?

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My thoughts are that bluffs and semi-bluffs cost me money every time I make them at SSNL. From last night:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 5 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

UTG ($48.75)
MP ($57.85)
Button ($68.15)
Hero ($126.4)
BB ($14.5)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Hero posts a blind of $0.25.
UTG calls $0.50, MP raises to $3, 1 fold, Hero (poster) calls $2.75, 1 fold, UTG folds.

Flop: ($7) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $7, Hero calls $7.

Turn: ($21) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $10, Hero calls $116.40 (All-In), MP calls $37.85 (All-In).

River: ($185.25) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $185.25

Results in white below: 
MP has Qs Jd (one pair, queens).
Hero has Ac Kh (high card, ace).
Outcome: MP wins $116.70. Hero wins $68.55.

AthenianStranger · #14 06-30-2005, 08:40 AM

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Flop: ($7) Q, 2, T (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $7, Hero calls $7.

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Whoa! You just fold it right there, mister!

TheWorstPlayer · #15 06-30-2005, 08:42 AM

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Flop: ($7) Q, 2, T (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $7, Hero calls $7.

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Whoa! You just fold it right there, mister!

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With two overs, backdoor nut flush draw, gutshot to the nuts, and what is very possibly the best hand?

AthenianStranger · #16 06-30-2005, 10:04 AM

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Flop: ($7) Q, 2, T (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $7, Hero calls $7.

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Whoa! You just fold it right there, mister!

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With two overs, backdoor nut flush draw, gutshot to the nuts, and what is very possibly the best hand?

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That doesn't sound so great to me, playing HU. But if you think this guy is just testing you because you showed weakness, that is another thing. I just think players at this level are going to be straightforward. I've been folding AK in this situation because I tend to end up doing what you did.

centja1 · #17 06-30-2005, 10:52 AM

the check raise does better represent a flush than betting right out, but I think you ultimately would have lost the hand. He still would have called your check-raise because he had outs to be a flush.

He called your $10 bet getting 1.8:1 when he clearly thought he needed to beat a flush and was only 3.6:1 to do so.

Even worse, what happens when you check on the flush card and he decides his set is good and overbets the pot by putting $15 in? If you check-raise all in, representing the flush, you don't have enough money to make it incorrect for him to draw to his full house.

I learned the hard way in a tournament that it is not smart to represent a hand to someone by pushing when they have draws to a hand that will beat the hand you're representing and getting not too much the worst of it. They may accidentally be calling with the best hand while thinking they need to draw to a better hand. I think it's better to wait until the river to make a big bluff like this because you've either represented a hand or haven't and they've either made the hand that beats the one you're representing or they haven't.

I personally like the stiff pot-sized bet on the turn.....make him decide whether you have a flush or not. You never would have been able to make the river bluff without having him call that bet on the turn and not raise.

Of course, once he called, i think you're pushing in on any card that doesn't pair the board since he has all but conceded that he thinks he needs to beat a flush.

TheWorstPlayer · #18 06-30-2005, 02:09 PM

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Flop: ($7) Q, 2, T (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $7, Hero calls $7.

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Whoa! You just fold it right there, mister!

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With two overs, backdoor nut flush draw, gutshot to the nuts, and what is very possibly the best hand?

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That doesn't sound so great to me, playing HU. But if you think this guy is just testing you because you showed weakness, that is another thing. I just think players at this level are going to be straightforward. I've been folding AK in this situation because I tend to end up doing what you did.

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That's fine, but you will be giving up a lot of value when you move up and people steal more. Obviously you're right, though. The guy called a pot-sized c/r when the flush hit with top pair, jack kicker, so I guess my move must have been extremely transparent. Or the guy sucks so bad he has never laid down top pair in his life. Yes, I'm pretty sure that was it.