AA at 2k NL

[AZK]

Agreed. What hand is going to fire on that river?

[diddle]

Theorem of 4 flush:

On a 4 flush board holding the suited Ace--

checking << betting

[nazbrok]

what else could he do ?
If he bets the river the only best hand he could beat is a Qc. If you had the Qc and you see you opponent bet the river, would you call the bet with the third nut ? I guess not so why take the risk to bet and getting reraise when he is pretty sure you will fold most of the time here (without the Ac).

[ZeeJustin]

[ QUOTE ]
what else could he do ?
If he bets the river the only best hand he could beat is a Qc. If you had the Qc and you see you opponent bet the river, would you call the bet with the third nut ? I guess not so why take the risk to bet and getting reraise when he is pretty sure you will fold most of the time here (without the Ac).

[/ QUOTE ]

If I check the caller, I'm calling with hands worse than Qc for sure.

[toiletduck]

Seems like he checks the 2nd nut because it's so easy to be nutted here, and you wont call with anything but the Ac really anyway.

FWIW I'd always push this river, in the hope of inducing a call from an accidental flush. That's my line for 2-4nl though, I have no idea if it'll fly at 10-20nl.

[ggbman]

Zee, i think the general problem here is that there are some flushes that won't bet river that bill call if you bet. It's hard to put him on KK given the action, although you thought it was possible. But if he has QQ with the club or a weridly played TT or something, even even maybe he turned the set with JJ, he may a call a river bet with all these hands but not bet them. Also, the long turn pause may be interpreted as you checking your odds for the flush IMO.

[Ulysses]

Bet the river.

[theBruiser500]

[ QUOTE ]
bad place to induce a bluff, IMO. I like a underbet better than a check and feel it accomplishes the same thing, but I like potish bet best.

--turnipmonster

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree completely

[theBruiser500]

zj, if he bets the river and you c/r he folds, if you bet and he calls it is the same result, you obtain that one bet of whatever bet size. so c/r has no advantage unless he is very bad and will call c/r with who knows what

[muzungu]

ZJ-

Looks like this one is pretty much taken care of, but I had a couple thoughts on the turn minraise. I will sometimes use this bet as a combination freeze bet/mini-extraction bet, and it seems like that is what he is doing here. He has a decent made hand and a decent draw, but he is not sure if he is best on either count. So if he raises big and you come over the top, he has to fold and loses the value of his draw. On the other hand, if he calls, he has a different set of problems. Perhaps he gave a free card to the naked A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], and perhaps you will fire again and he will have to make a tough call. So the min-raise is the best of both worlds- it gets a little value if he is ahead, perhaps it causes you to check a slightly stronger hand on the river, or to go for a c/r with a monster (at which point he happily checks behind), and if you 3-bet the turn he isn't sticking his neck out too far. I think QQc or KKc are logical holdings for him here, and were I in his shoes I might minraise as well.

-muz