Etiquette when you see someones hand

[MtDon]

[ QUOTE ]
On the weekend a friend of mine accidentally saw someones hand as he flicked the card vertically when they check 'em rather than using the thumb as most do. This player didn't seem like a rookie, just a bit lazy. The player had AJ, and my friend had AQ. A dominating hand. My friend didn't want to say anything right away, he hoped he could fold out so as to avoid an immoral situation. there was a PFR, AJ called and my friend 3-bet. Original raiser called as did AJ. The flop had a queen. My friend bet and both of them called. It was at this point my friend told AJ that he'd seen his cards. The turn came another rag, my friend bet both other players called then the river. My friend bet and AJ folded. My friend won the pot and decided it was fair to give AJ nack his turn and flop bets some $12, but thought it was overkill to give him his $12 call pre flop as he would have made this play anyway. Is this fair? What would you do in this situation? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

It was perfectly ethical to use the information fropm seeing his oponent's cards. However, I'd say it was unethical to tell him you had seen them during the play of the hand with someone else still in the hand. There was the possibility that the third player had the best hand. If he had the best hand, your telling the other player that you had seen his cards could have killed the third player's action. This is a type of collusion, though perfectly innocently intended by your friend. If you were heads up, then it would have been be okay.



-- Don

PS: I know my pronouns (he, you, etc.) are a bit mixed up.

[SpeakEasy]

When the hand is over and you're stacking the chips, you say:
"I think you had," pause thoughtfully, "ace-jack."
Opponent stares in astonishment.
"Get my point?"

Opponent either:
A) Understands that he is giving a free peek, and corrects his blunder, or
B) Realizes that you are a mind-reading Hellmuthian poker genius.

Moral dilemma solved.

[defence18]

I agree with shutupndeal. If someone is not protecting their cards, it is open season. This goes along with that "I'd bust my grandmother if she was playing with me" philosophy. We play for money, and anyone sitting at the table is someone we can win money from. As previously said, this game is about information. If you pick up a tell on someone, are you going to tell them? To me, that's the same thing. You have utilyzed some piece of information that has alerted you to your opponent's holdings. I have sat at a lot of tables where someone has said to another player, "Look, I'm just gonna say this once, but protect your hand, b/c if I wanted to, I can see your cards." But that is something that I will never say unless I'm sitting next to a good friend. I was hesitant to say this, but shutupndeal sort of hit on it, but I was in a similar situation at a hold 'em table. This older, not elderly, but older gentleman was sitting to my right, and he was lazily checking his cards. And, since I watch as the action rotates around the table, I would often get to see his cards. I wasn't looking for them, but they were often there. I said nothing, and furthermore, had no remorse about it. In my opinion, it was his fault, not mine. Yes, I profited from it, but I never gave money back and I never said a word. He eventually left the table. Just my feelings on the subject.

[jumister5889]

I definately wouldn'tve given his money back, in fact i wouldn'tve even told him i saw his cards. No one would've known and i don't think i wouldve played the hand any differently [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

[pzhon]

Giving the guy some money looks like it would cause a problem, not solve one. He might think your friend had nothing, and pushed him off the best hand with unfair information. That may upset him. If I wanted to tell him I could see his cards, I would show the queen after the hand, and then I would tell him and not give him any money.