99 on level 3

[dfscott]

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I'm going to almost utterly ignore this hand and concentrate on something else.
FWIW the hand looks fine.

Bet out the flop?

You did this recently with 88 or something similar.

Why do you keep trying to bet flops you have missed? If you really want to bet a flop you have missed, you're better putting the chips in preflop when you might still be ahead.

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Lori, I'm pretty sure this is nothing like that 88 hand. Hero didn't bet out here. And I'm confident his question is concerning preflop actions, not postflop.

We hope hero has learned that betting out postflop when he's missed has been plugged.

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To be fair, I did consider betting the flop but I didn't because:

a) I'm out of position,
b) The K is likely to have hit someone, and
c) A heart draw is likely to call (I'm really only interesting in betting if I can take it down right here).

If it had been checked through and a card under my pair had fallen, I might've bet the turn.

[dfscott]

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Push preflop. This what I was talking about the other day.

What would you do with this hand on the button on level 4 (50/100)? You'd push, of course. Well, there's more money to be had here (175 in pot), so why are you fooling around with a call?

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I really considered pushing pre-flop. This is a case where I'm likely to win long-term, but I think it is likely that I'm going to get overcard callers that hit at the 10s. I just have to get used to the fact that sometimes I'm going to lose to people who make bad calls.

[Texas Pete]

If you push preflop you give two overcards the pot odds to call you. (Pot is 50+50+75+680 = 855; costs either one of them 680-50 = 630 to call.) Plus, you can't do anything about UTG having an overpair to you at that point.

If want to make an aggressive play, you can raise preflop (say T200). If UTG reraises, you can let it go. If he just calls, you can put him on two high cards and consider pushing on the flop. If only one or zero high cards hit the flop it'd be a decent bet.

The play you made was good. T25 for a T175 pot, if you hit your trips you'll probably have a customer who will double you up. You didn't get 'em, so you check and fold. Nothing wrong with that at all.

[Phil Van Sexton]

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If you push preflop you give two overcards the pot odds to call you. (Pot is 50+50+75+680 = 855; costs either one of them 680-50 = 630 to call.)

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Unless your opponent can see your cards, this isn't really important. If he's sitting there with QT, I doubt he's calculating the pot odds against 99. If he is, he's cheating or an idiot.

In reality, he will fold because that he is AT BEST in a coin flip against a lower pair.

[Texas Pete]

(1) So are you saying the T200 raise is a bad play? If so, why?

(2) Which play would you say was better, the T200 raise or the push, and why?

[Phil Van Sexton]

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(1) So are you saying the T200 raise is a bad play?

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yes.

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If so, why?

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- 200 is almost 1/3 of his stack.
- His stack is small, so he's pretty much pot committed if someone calls or raises.
- The limpers would be getting some pretty good odds to call 150 more and see the flop with overcards.

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(2) Which play would you say was better, the T200 raise or the push, and why?

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- The push is better because you want to win the pot right now. It's big enough.
- A 200 bet will pot commit you, but with less folding equity than a push.
- You almost certainly have the best hand. Other than TT, any better hand would likely have raised already
- If called, you are likely to be in a coin flip AT WORST.

[Texas Pete]

Putting in a little less than 1/3 of your stack makes you pot committed if someone calls? (If 99 is re-raised by UTG, he can fold putting UTG on QQ-AA. It's not a bad play to limp UTG with a high pair, now and then, if you expect an aggressive player to raise you. Personally, I never limp with QQ-AA.)

The fact is you have almost no information in the SB, with two limpers, about the strength of their hands. Raising gets you that information at the cost of T200. Pushing with two limpers, they can put you on any pair or A9os and above, something like that.

[curtains]

You do have a lot of information. Your opponents limped, this usually means they DON'T have a big hand. Sometimes they will, but most of the time they won't. If people limping in isn't enough information for you then I don't know what is.

[curtains]

I really hate raising to 200. You can't always be so careful in these situations. You might entice hands liek QTs to take a flop against you, and you really don't want that. You need to take this down preflop, and if you get called and it's a coinflip, then so be it. Or if someone was slowplaying AA-QQ then that's okay too, sometimes this has to happen to you.

[lastchance]

You want to fold after putting a third of your stack in the middle with a pair? What are you thinking?

You don't have a deep enough stack to try to make a bet for information.

You can either push or complete here, IMHO. Completing isn't horrible, but I really like pushing here. In fact, go ahead and push, your stack is only 13x BB, there's a lot of chips in the middle, and nines are really strong here.

You don't need information about their hand. They limped, you have pocket nines and about 13x BB. You certainly don't want to get called and have an overcard board hit. Folding here after a t200 raise is horrible, and so is calling, so push preflop.