Over/Under

[AZK]

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Oh, how nice a river spade would have been...

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Yeah, seriously....side note, you took some time to call the bet, were you really thinking he filled up given the action? I missed the flop play...

Also, you seem to talk a decent amount there while playing I'm normally not used to seeing people do this, are you doing this for image purposes?

[Dr. Strangelove]

From memory :board was ~TJQK with two spades. Mahatma in big blind checks, ElD checks, late position bets pot ~175, Mahatma calls, ElD raises to 750 (afterwhich he has 2000-2500 behind), late position folds. Mahatma ponders an inordinate amount of time and calls. River is a non-spade King, and Mahatma moves in. ElD calls showing Axs spades, Mahatma has an ace, pot is split.

Numbers may be slightly off.

[Ulysses]

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Yeah, seriously....side note, you took some time to call the bet, were you really thinking he filled up given the action? I missed the flop play...

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I just like to think things through for a sec before making multi-thousand dollar decisions.

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Also, you seem to talk a decent amount there while playing I'm normally not used to seeing people do this, are you doing this for image purposes?

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Man, I'm just playing some poker, having some fun. Chatting is fun.

[tbach24]

[ QUOTE ]
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Yeah, seriously....side note, you took some time to call the bet, were you really thinking he filled up given the action? I missed the flop play...

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I just like to think things through for a sec before making multi-thousand dollar decisions.

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LOL. Probably smart.

[AZK]

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I just like to think things through for a sec before making multi-thousand dollar decisions.

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I didn't mean for my question to come out the way it did...I wasn't short-changing you or anything, basically what I was getting at was that most of the time I come to my decisions farily quickly if I've played with a set group of individuals for a while or feel that I have a pretty good idea of how the table is playing. However, despite knowing my decision in a matter of seconds, I'll sometimes take a few even if I end up folding or calling etc so that other plays don't catch on to the time I take for different decisions, that is all I was getting at. I was wondering if you bere planning to call regardless but were sweating it out or what not...meh?

[TheWorstPlayer]

When it gets to you, there is 600 in the pot (including your call) and you raise around the size of the pot. I don't understand. Were you hoping to get a call from a set or two pair? If you aren't going to lay down to a push on the river when the board pairs, then a set isn't getting bad odds. You have the nuts and are free-rolling another ace. Why not push here? If you push, you are putting another ace (which seems like a very likely hand for at least one of your opponents to have) in a very bad spot since you are free-rolling them if they call but obviously can't be happy about folding the nuts. And you would obviously be giving terrible odds to a set or two pair.

Of course, I don't play anywhere near this high, but anything other than pushing here just doesn't make any sense to me, so I would love it if someone could explain.

[JaBlue]

He's trying to get in as much money as possible while freerolling

[TheWorstPlayer]

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He's trying to get in as much money as possible while freerolling

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Explain how his bet gets in more money than just pushing. On the upside, if he pushes he charges any potential draws more and he also removes the possibility of someone getting away when the flush hits on the river.

When I analyse all the possible situations, it looks like this to me:
In the situation where someone else has an ace and no one has a set or two pair:
If you push and they call, you get it all in on a freeroll with no chance of losing money. Can't get better than that.
If your draw hits you stack them, if it doesn't you split.

If you push and they fold, you win a pot that was going to be split 75% of the time. If they would have called 600, and your draw would have hit, then you would have made another 600, but presumably they will get away when your draw hits (after all, fear of a freeroll has to be why they folded the nuts to your push, right?). So you lose 600 when your draw would have hit, if they will call 600 but fold to a push, but you win half the pot (300) when your draw would have missed. And your draw only hits 1/4 so that would be 1/4*-600 + 3/4*300 = +75. So even if he would call your 600 and he would fold to your push (which seems like the worst possible case for pushing) it is still +EV to push.

Then, of course, in the situation where someone has a set, it is better to make them make a mistake by calling, so it looks like it should at least be 1K or so, since you are going to call a river push against these tricky opponents even if the board pairs. But it seems more likely from the action that someone just hit the nuts on the turn than that someone had a set on the flop and didn't bet it hard.

So, I'm just wondering where my thinking is going wrong. Still seems to me like only good things could come from pushing here. Do you really think people are likely to fold the nuts on the turn for free of the free-roll? Even if they do, it is good for you, and I doubt they are likely to (at least without REALLY deep stacks) so you would definitely be getting the max in on the freeroll.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Mahatma basically can't have a set here, and won't call 600 more with only 4 outs to a fullhouse. He will probably correctly fold to an all-in here, but may be tempted to represent the flush (will definitely represent the fullhouse) on the river after calling the 600 on the turn.

There is also another person in the hand who may have an ace.

Personally I raise more here, and probably move in, trying to sell the idea that I have a naked ace and don't want to split. This might not be the most profitable line though.

[Kaz The Original]

Link to OP?