ATo

[davelin]

[ QUOTE ]
If betting out on the previous hand was a bad move, here's a hand were it seems more justified:

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">6 folds</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds.

This flop is probably worse than the last one, but since I'm only up against one villain it seems more justified, esp. after the PF raise.

Is the PF raise too aggressive from UTG+2? I would not hesitate doing it from MP, but I had had a good run at this table and decided to try a fast one and narrow the field.

[/ QUOTE ]

I usually fold this pre-flop.

[Dead]

You shouldn't be playing ATo until at least Mp3.

[Shillx]

[ QUOTE ]
You shouldn't be playing ATo until at least Mp3.

[/ QUOTE ]

If AJo is profitable to play UTG, ATo must be slightly -EV UTG. Waiting until MP3 to play it is silly. You should be able to get some EV out of it by open raising in MP1.

Brad

[Shillx]

Yeah but UTG+2 folded for 2 more bets, not one.

Anyway, why did you check the turn in this hand? At least follow though with your crazy flop play. If you are good, you don't really want to give a free card do you?

Brad

[Dead]

I'm not convinced that AJo is profitable to play UTG in some games.

And profitability depends on how Hero plays his hands.

If Hero 3bets routinely like he did in the above hand, ATo can change from marginally profitable in MP1 to being very unprofitable.

[Shillx]

Don't fold AJo in EP. Just don't do it. It IS profitable. It took me a lot of hands to figure it out. There are some things that you have to find out on your own, but not playing AJo is not smart. There aren't too many hands that are +EV in EP, but this is one of them.

If AJo isn't profitable in the game you are playing, you are playing in the wrong game. It is profitable in any Party 3/6 or 5/10 game, as it is in any micro game. I'll wager my bankroll on it.

Brad

[Carmine]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah but UTG+2 folded for 2 more bets, not one.

Anyway, why did you check the turn in this hand? At least follow though with your crazy flop play. If you are good, you don't really want to give a free card do you?

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

This is what I found as the strangest part of your play. If you are going to show all that strength on the flop you must continue with your plan and lead the turn. I don't think you thought that far ahead on this one. Sometimes a card can force us to change our anticipated line but I don't think the 9 dropping is one of those times.

[Dead]

[ QUOTE ]
Don't fold AJo in EP. Just don't do it. It IS profitable. It took me a lot of hands to figure it out. There are some things that you have to find out on your own, but not playing AJo is not smart. There aren't too many hands that are +EV in EP, but this is one of them.

If AJo isn't profitable in the game you are playing, you are playing in the wrong game. It is profitable in any Party 3/6 or 5/10 game, as it is in any micro game. I'll wager my bankroll on it.

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

If AJo is definitely profitable from UTG then why does SSH say ATo is not profitable until LP. It's only one pip of difference.

And why not A9o from LP as well?

[Carmine]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Don't fold AJo in EP. Just don't do it. It IS profitable. It took me a lot of hands to figure it out. There are some things that you have to find out on your own, but not playing AJo is not smart. There aren't too many hands that are +EV in EP, but this is one of them.

If AJo isn't profitable in the game you are playing, you are playing in the wrong game. It is profitable in any Party 3/6 or 5/10 game, as it is in any micro game. I'll wager my bankroll on it.

Brad

[/ QUOTE ]

If AJo is definitely profitable from UTG then why does SSH say ATo is not profitable until LP. It's only one pip of difference.

And why not A9o from LP as well?

[/ QUOTE ]

My "theory" would be that in an Ace hand which is played by every poor SS player kicker strengh becomes more important than position. If you hold A9 and your opponent holds AT how much does position help you?
If he is first to act and bets out on a A74 flop you are going to fold?? Going to raise for information you say. depending on how bad he is it may be reliable. But I think more than likly you end up at showdown losing. The differance being you are an expert player so you lost less than most [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]. Again just "my theory"

[Dead]

All good points, but I don't think that A9 is much weaker than AT at all.